More proof what a rorschach test movies and other entertainment can be. It reminds me of the debates about Dark Knight being either a defense of, or indictment of, the war on terror, or the debates about Dark Knight Rises being either a defense of, or indictment of, the occupy movement. Each side saw what they wanted to in those respective films.
I do find it amusing that so many people see a "feminist agenda" in a film that only barely passes the Bechdel test thanks to a couple of very short scenes. Disney has undoubtedly made a conscious effort to add women in more prominent roles, and considering the popularity the films have with women, why not? Daisy Ridley, Felicity Jones, Laura Dern, and more have all done great jobs, and helped breathe new life into the series.
Both sides of the ideological spectrum see TLJ as being feminist:
Orange-haired general--who could that be based on?--from a powerful new organization which comes seemingly out of nowhere "The Unknown Regions" (aka "Flyover Country"?) takes out the Rebel Alliance, inexplicably called "The Resistance" (taken from the feminist #Resist movement) and that's just for starters.
I don't think anyone's going to change anyone else's minds here, so I'll leave it at that.
Sean Nethery: Have the Star Wars newspaper strips vol 2 on the way, as it's due out Feb 14. IDW has done a fine job with it (and the "Steve Canyon" strip, too)
More proof what a rorschach test movies and other entertainment can be. It reminds me of the debates about Dark Knight being either a defense of, or indictment of, the war on terror, or the debates about Dark Knight Rises being either a defense of, or indictment of, the occupy movement. Each side saw what they wanted to in those respective films.
I do find it amusing that so many people see a "feminist agenda" in a film that only barely passes the Bechdel test thanks to a couple of very short scenes. Disney has undoubtedly made a conscious effort to add women in more prominent roles, and considering the popularity the films have with women, why not? Daisy Ridley, Felicity Jones, Laura Dern, and more have all done great jobs, and helped breathe new life into the series.
Both sides of the ideological spectrum see TLJ as being feminist:
Orange-haired general--who could that be based on?--from a powerful new organization which comes seemingly out of nowhere "The Unknown Regions" (aka "Flyover Country"?) takes out the Rebel Alliance, inexplicably called "The Resistance" (taken from the feminist #Resist movement) and that's just for starters.
I don't think anyone's going to change anyone else's minds here, so I'll leave it at that.
Sean Nethery: Have the Star Wars newspaper strips vol 2 on the way, as it's due out Feb 14. IDW has done a fine job with it (and the "Steve Canyon" strip, too)
Well at least we have exchanged views. I know there are people who liked the movie. It seems to me that there are more that didn't (not that that means anything these days). It is shocking to me though that the score on rotten tomatoes is now 48%. Shocking in that it may determine what happens to the direction of the narrative perhaps.
Sean Nethery: Have the Star Wars newspaper strips vol 2 on the way, as it's due out Feb 14. IDW has done a fine job with it (and the "Steve Canyon" strip, too)
Did you ever check out the "Classic Star Wars" series Darkhorse Comics published years and years ago? They took the Archie Goodwin/Al Williamson comic strips and with assistance from Al Williamson reformatted and colored the strips so that it took advantage of the comic book medium. It was some fantastic work, and Al Williamson's art really jumps out. Although purists may be aghast, I thought they did a great job taking advantage of the strengths of the comic book medium while preserving some great stories. I believe they did the same with Russ Manning strips, but I wasn't as in to those, so I didn't collect much of that series.
Sean Nethery: Have the Star Wars newspaper strips vol 2 on the way, as it's due out Feb 14. IDW has done a fine job with it (and the "Steve Canyon" strip, too)
Did you ever check out the "Classic Star Wars" series Darkhorse Comics published years and years ago? They took the Archie Goodwin/Al Williamson comic strips and with assistance from Al Williamson reformatted and colored the strips so that it took advantage of the comic book medium. It was some fantastic work, and Al Williamson's art really jumps out. Although purists may be aghast, I thought they did a great job taking advantage of the strengths of the comic book medium while preserving some great stories. I believe they did the same with Russ Manning strips, but I wasn't as in to those, so I didn't collect much of that series.
...but I didn't like the reformatting you mention, so I did not get the rest of the series.
There was also an expensive two-volume hardcover Star Wars comic strip Goodwin-Williamson collection, but it was at least $100.00, which would have been too expensive for me.
Well at least we have exchanged views. I know there are people who liked the movie. It seems to me that there are more that didn't (not that that means anything these days). It is shocking to me though that the score on rotten tomatoes is now 48%. Shocking in that it may determine what happens to the direction of the narrative perhaps.
There have been many (video) reviews--and rants--from "non-professional" reviewers that have been far more insightful than any of the mainstream media reviewers' efforts. The 91% favorable critical rating compared to the 48% "Joe and Jane" gave it, is quite telling.
Well at least we have exchanged views. I know there are people who liked the movie. It seems to me that there are more that didn't (not that that means anything these days). It is shocking to me though that the score on rotten tomatoes is now 48%. Shocking in that it may determine what happens to the direction of the narrative perhaps.
There have been many (video) reviews--and rants--from "non-professional" reviewers that have been far more insightful than any of the mainstream media reviewers' efforts. The 91% favorable critical rating compared to the 48% "Joe and Jane" gave it, is quite telling.
I am not really into the review culture. What do you think is the reason for the disparity?
Sean Nethery: Have the Star Wars newspaper strips vol 2 on the way, as it's due out Feb 14. IDW has done a fine job with it (and the "Steve Canyon" strip, too)
Did you ever check out the "Classic Star Wars" series Darkhorse Comics published years and years ago? They took the Archie Goodwin/Al Williamson comic strips and with assistance from Al Williamson reformatted and colored the strips so that it took advantage of the comic book medium. It was some fantastic work, and Al Williamson's art really jumps out. Although purists may be aghast, I thought they did a great job taking advantage of the strengths of the comic book medium while preserving some great stories. I believe they did the same with Russ Manning strips, but I wasn't as in to those, so I didn't collect much of that series.
My heart missed a beat when I saw Manning's name mentioned. I have been an afficiando of his since the early days. The SW comics he drew were done near the end of his career or just before his sad and premature death. I have full original collections of his Robot Fighter and Tarzan comic/strips. Oddly enough, I thought the Coruscant cityscape was very reminiscent of the cityscape from his Robot Fighter comic book series.
Glad to know about the Manning strips vol. 2 coming out, Jim. Haven't picked up 1 yet, but I still have my eye on it. Like Michael, I love the Dark Horse reworking of the Goodwin/Williamson strips, so my bias is towards that kind of thing, as I tend to get worn out by the necessary repetition of day-by-day strip storytelling.
As to Last Jedi popularity, it has just passed $1.32 billion, way ahead of Rogue One. And it's got a 7.5 rating on IMDB, far less likely to have been gamed than Rotten Tomatoes. So for all the video rants and Internet outrage, clearly the movie is a success. But a highly polarizing one.
PS Here is why Last Jedi ultimately cannot be described as feminist. Who finally saves the day? Luke and Rey, working separately but together.
After 6 movies where females were marginalized, we now have two movies where both genders have key heroic roles. That's not feminist, that's integrationist.
Thought I'd poke my head in on a lark and see what people here had to say about Star Wars for some reason. Anyway, I couldn't get past the most recent post in this thread to bother reading what the rest of people are saying, but do you really think that feminism espouses superiority of women? The feminism movement is literally only about seeking equal treatment.
.... Anyway, I couldn't get past the most recent post in this thread to bother reading what the rest of people are saying, but do you really think that feminism espouses superiority of women? ....
Um, no, I don't, if you are linking me to that sentiment, but that is often how feminism is indeed portrayed, by members of both genders. That's just another in the endless stream of examples of how words get freighted over time, and why I think we need a better term, whether mine is it or not.
And may also demonstrate a reason to bother to read more posts before reacting to just one.
And may also demonstrate a reason to bother to read more posts before reacting to just one.
Nah
Glad to know about the Manning strips vol. 2 coming out, Jim. Haven't picked up 1 yet, but I still have my eye on it. Like Michael, I love the Dark Horse reworking of the Goodwin/Williamson strips, so my bias is towards that kind of thing, as I tend to get worn out by the necessary repetition of day-by-day strip storytelling.
I guess it depends on who's writing and/or editing said strips. Both Steve Canyon and Star Wars flow quite smoothly imo. Milton Caniff does a swell job of moving his stories along, as does Archie Goodwin, who is considered one of, if not THE most respected editors in comic book history. I'm uncertain as to whether he edited his Star Wars comic strips, though. .
I remember the repetition of Chris Claremont's X-Men, in which every issue informed us about Wolverine's Adamantium claws and Cyclops' visor. Repetition was a necessity in latching on to new or casual readers every month or every day. Now the reader damn well better catch up some other way.
Jim, good point on the strips and how like everything else, it just depends. Now that you mention it, I remember that about Steve Canyon. I'm getting both of the Manning collection for sure. Oh, wait, I was looking at the Marvel/Disney printing rather than the IDW - I prefer the lighter paperbacks. Now I'll have to see which one I should go for.
Convincing some Rey is a Mary Sue is like convincing some Flat-Earhers the Earth is round....
No actually it's not. In the case of Rey, there ain't no objective reality to be embraced or ignored. It's all just opinion - plain as the nose on my face and different from yours. But we all smell.
Jim, good point on the strips and how like everything else, it just depends. Now that you mention it, I remember that about Steve Canyon. I'm getting both of the Manning collection for sure. Oh, wait, I was looking at the Marvel/Disney printing rather than the IDW - I prefer the lighter paperbacks. Now I'll have to see which one I should go for.
And nice video buh-bye there. Good 'un!
FYI, the Russ Manning Star Wars strips are only in vol. 1. Vols. 2 and 3 are Goodwin-Williamson. (and Alcala).
Yes, thanks, Jim, I finally realized that but didn't quite fix my post on Manning. Now I can see the reason to buy the IDW's, to see the original versions of the Goodwin/Williamson run (though I still love the Dark Horse re-works).
And this has made me remember that I have the Dark Horse version of Manning as a digital collection - I know it's been fussed with, but I guess I oughta start with what I already have, nu?
