 |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Saul, no one wants to understand the difference and that's fine. We tried 
There is also deceptive remastering, which you don't seem to acknowledge. This is different from "bad" remastering.
An example would be mildly tweaking the previous remaster and hyping a release as "newly remastered" to move units. That is deceptive, regardless of whether the result is particularly "good" or "bad."
I don't understand you. Maybe you can explain you to me? You want me to acknowledge that anyone can say newly remastered as a publicity tool. I believe I said that in a roundabout way when talking about Blu-ray and 2 and 4K transfers, but of course anyone can say anything but in the end if it's deceptive and pointless then it's bad.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
What I am curious about are the differences in mastering for CD versus the high resolution formats. With the limitations of the redbook CD standard not a factor, how much more latitude do the mastering engineers have with a wider frequency response and available bandwidth? I would imagine that there is a standard defined for mastering in those formats, similar to the redbook standard for CD's.
Very
MaxB
|
|
|
|
|
|
What I am curious about are the differences in mastering for CD versus the high resolution formats. With the limitations of the redbook CD standard not a factor, how much more latitude do the mastering engineers have with a wider frequency response and available bandwidth? I would imagine that there is a standard defined for mastering in those formats, similar to the redbook standard for CD's.
Very
MaxB
All depends on the source. I just did a complete remix on a vocal album we did - was never really happy with the first attempt that came out on CD. So, this is all hi-rez now and available as a download, and it actually didn't involve any mastering because it was great and the engineer made sure the sound levels were consistent. So, it's exactly the new mix without any sauce at all and the difference is astounding, I must say. But yes, more leeway in dynamics for sure.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
 |
Posted: |
Oct 5, 2020 - 6:16 PM
|
|
|
|
By: |
Grecchus
(Member)
|
The first of the 3 presentations was specifically about getting hands-on of 1st gen tapes - ones with the original edit join sticky-tape fixes to add to the track sequence. That was a Bernstein original for a non-film score classical piece of music. Would that 1st gen be easier to secure than a film score 1st gen, or was that a genuine scoop, because no great fanfare in obtaining that original source was announced for someone like me to be able to tell the difference. Then again, film scores may not have been denigrated by the likes of Previn, however, a classical recording would have taken precedence. Generally, I'm still wondering if, hitherto, it would have been the case that the set of tapes used to create the master from which to pull off all succeeding mixes could conceivably have been 2nd gen, or later? I used to work with mag tape in a seismic data environment and we'd have hands on to original materials and I can tell you that foulups would sometimes occur leading to a creased up piece of tape. In such circumstances, you'd hope to create the image immediately after the tape was set in motion and recorded and definitely not after any kind of foulup! That's a pretty good reason not to provide 1st gen tapes, especially if you're going to just copy digital to digital. Surely, there would have to be some kind of best practices agreement set out before the materials were handed over by the caretaker to the media operator.
Rant over. I found that to be an interesting overview. What is the likelihood of that example Bernstein tape source being taken off its home shelfspace at a later date, given that an updated digital image with a fine-detail reading head was taken to enable the remaster to happen? The other thing is the 40 odd year old tape looked to be in remarkably good condish.
Edit: Bruce, you're saying that last example was a case of cleaning up what was rendered from off the source tapes - if that's not re-mastering, what process is it?
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
All depends on the source. I just did a complete remix on a vocal album we did - was never really happy with the first attempt that came out on CD. So, this is all hi-rez now and available as a download, and it actually didn't involve any mastering because it was great and the engineer made sure the sound levels were consistent. So, it's exactly the new mix without any sauce at all and the difference is astounding, I must say. But yes, more leeway in dynamics for sure.
I just searched around the Kritzerland site and couldn't find any downloads. What are you trying to pull?
|
|
|
|
|
|
The first of the 3 presentations was specifically about getting hands-on of 1st gen tapes - ones with the original edit join sticky-tape fixes to add to the track sequence. That was a Bernstein original for a non-film score classical piece of music. Would that 1st gen be easier to secure than a film score 1st gen, or was that a genuine scoop, because no great fanfare in obtaining that original source was announced for someone like me to be able to tell the difference. Then again, film scores may not have been denigrated by the likes of Previn, however, a classical recording would have taken precedence. Generally, I'm still wondering if, hitherto, it would have been the case that the set of tapes used to create the master from which to pull off all succeeding mixes could conceivably have been 2nd gen, or later? I used to work with mag tape in a seismic data environment and we'd have hands on to original materials and I can tell you that foulups would sometimes occur leading to a creased up piece of tape. In such circumstances, you'd hope to create the image immediately after the tape was set in motion and recorded and definitely not after any kind of foulup! That's a pretty good reason not to provide 1st gen tapes, especially if you're going to just copy digital to digital. Surely, there would have to be some kind of best practices agreement set out before the materials were handed over by the caretaker to the media operator.
Rant over. I found that to be an interesting overview. What is the likelihood of that example Bernstein tape source being taken off its home shelfspace at a later date, given that an updated digital image with a fine-detail reading head was taken to enable the remaster to happen? The other thing is the 40 odd year old tape looked to be in remarkably good condish.
Edit: Bruce, you're saying that last example was a case of cleaning up what was rendered from off the source tapes - if that's not re-mastering, what process is it?
If you're talking about the vocal album I referenced, it was a completely new mix from start to finish. Had nothing to do with remastering because we're not issuing it on CD.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
All depends on the source. I just did a complete remix on a vocal album we did - was never really happy with the first attempt that came out on CD. So, this is all hi-rez now and available as a download, and it actually didn't involve any mastering because it was great and the engineer made sure the sound levels were consistent. So, it's exactly the new mix without any sauce at all and the difference is astounding, I must say. But yes, more leeway in dynamics for sure.
I just searched around the Kritzerland site and couldn't find any downloads. What are you trying to pull?
We haven't put it up on the site yet, but will at some point. It's tricky and not so cheap to get the site prepared for downloads.
|
|
|
|
|
|
The first of the 3 presentations was specifically about getting hands-on of 1st gen tapes - ones with the original edit join sticky-tape fixes to add to the track sequence. That was a Bernstein original for a non-film score classical piece of music. Would that 1st gen be easier to secure than a film score 1st gen, or was that a genuine scoop, because no great fanfare in obtaining that original source was announced for someone like me to be able to tell the difference.
Well, film scores were/are more or less seen as byproducts for the movie. Once the movie was finished and a soundtrack master had been made, there was often little consideration about what to do with the original session masters. Sometimes they were filed and labelled, sometimes someone snatched them, sometimes they were lost.
In case of Deutsche Grammophon session tapes (or Decca, or EMI, etc. of course), the original session tape IS the bread & butter. It's a music label, not a film production company. So the original session tapes are almost always correctly labelled, filed, and stored in temperature controlled vaults. It's usually not hard to find or locate an original session tape or album master at Deutsche Grammophon, because you just go to the vault and pick it up.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
