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Consideration. Bad sellers 'extreme' nightmare stories. The question of integrity.
I am posting [edit] 2 nightmare experiences + 1 interesting one for feedback for sellers and illustration of the methods that some bad sellers, whether instances of zero integrity, dishonesty or outright fraud. Also, feedback and perspective for vendors or those who are actively selling and buying.
Three examples:
1) The eBay fraud.
Theme: we will mislist, lie, exploit and waste your time.
Nightmare. These are almost always seller who turn over a lot of product, don't check or care and copy/paste synopises and product listings. They will list whatever and escape any consequences, knowing ebay and paypal will protect them regardless of even hard evidence and proof fraud.
2) The Vinegar Syndrome.
Theme: We are not going to waste our time on you.
Like the label's name, this case is not nightmare, but rather like the name, a cocktail of one part: astringent bitters + one part: syn. And unfortunately and common 'syndrome' and example of when a label becomes too successful and too big that they just can't be bothered to be hassled and individual buyers don't matter. The cold hard face of the mega-corporation (or attitude) arrives. One thing is good: their packaging. The other bad: your time and existence is meaningless. This wasn't the way they started but now is reality.
I have not had this experience elsewise, but I have heard the attitude from some sellers who are enjoying mass sales both frustration against buyers, and due to the sellers own technical faults" who ultimately will just tell the buyer to screw off. This is not a mortal sin UNLESS that seller or vendor actually took the buyer's money, SEE NEXT EXAMPLE.
There is no reason to be a jerk, and if a seller if thinking that the buyer emailing them is a jerk, then perhaps they should just act professional and offer a resolution of amends or options, like a professional. Business is business. If there is a mistake, it is the seller, not the buyer's responsibility to handle all costs or make available all options as to not inconvenience or cost the buyer any more money. Period.
If in the case of a bad situation, then the Vinegar Syndrome of cancelling a pending order would be appropriate but only with the simple professional courtesy of notice and option to buyer some final response to buyer. For example, if something is unacceptable or changes within the context of order, then give the buyer a chance. The problem was probably not their fault and they might not be happy, which is rational to expect. If it is the seller fault then take the responsibility and demonstrate some professional courtesy and apology.
Vinegar Syndrome in my experience violated this harshly. Example. I bothered to put a large order over several days, multiple adjoined orders in a sale (this action was welcomed and advised) and made a simple request that they could have opted out. Instead that mis-stated, or changed their mind out lack of care to customer, are the party that made the error and just bailed out without notice or option. Extremely poor form.
As perspective, it is doubtful I would order their own product again from them, at least direct. But it is not set in stone at least of picking up their product from OTHER sellers. But let's put it this way: VS collection gets last priority for standard buying.
The next example violates basically every rule, pure tyrannical attitude, based in disingenous action that implies an item was sent damaged, buyer was overcharged on shipping (easy cost of s/h 50% less than that was paid) and finally either way, when error discovered, zero intent or option to resolve, which equates to theft.
3) ScreenArchives.
Theme: Quote, "We are not going to waste our time and money (but we will take, overcharge, lie and steal yours, even if its our mistake)"
Nightmare. This is the opposite of VS. Bad 1990s website, poor account setup and data handling. Old signs of lackluster care and service. Worse this particular 'story' is a true example representing the seller not because they are big of successful but rather a longtime site where they are so cheap, they double charge on shipping (2x any other vendor or shop on the web, from the indie shops to the big companies). Also this is an example where they might garner decent sales, but will skimp in certain scenarios, such as awful or dirt cheap packaging while charging ultra-premium, yet shipping clearly econ 1/2 the price paid; and poorly in general but also sending smaller, non-regular customers damaged goods. And when something goes wrong or a complaint comes in they will blame anybody but themself and refuse to lose any of their "own time and money" (see email excerpt at end of scenario).
1. EBAY NIGHTMARE
I had one other scenario on eBay regarding this year in 2021, ordering a supposed special limited edition. I caught the seller in messaging admitting their mislisting and then refusing a paid return, stating they were going to correct the listing the same night of message), and causing simply a loss to me as buyer. They continued to sell the bluray, never correcting their listing. I informed ebay 3 times, they did absolutely nothing. A week later, all copies sold. And due to the fact that it was limited, apparently in this time frame, most buyers never opened.
I also ended up leaving negtive feedback, simple, and to the point within the meager character limit. 4 other other people also had negative feedback on other discs for similar scenario. Ebay expunged them all. Screencapped it, time-stamped it proof. I retained everything. Next I went to paypal. Nothing. Longtime story ebay and paypal were supposed to be legally seperated in crica 2016. They are integrated and are not. I digress.
A FEW BAD APPLES
Many people will be familiar with the many labels and shops. I have only had issue with 2. I would also like to say that the woman who handles Shout Factory orders is great. I had one short message and ask and she was kind enough to actually send me something to remedy an insignificant issue.
This was 2 bad orders I have had only recently after ordering from most vendors and labels, many times. But it seems in 2021, the frequency of either total discourtesy or blatant rip off is being the norm, especially from vendors who sit high on their horse raking massive sales on bluray and yet possessing little integrity.
2. THE ASTRINGENT TASTE OF VINEGAR
Vinegar Syndrome I bothered to place a very expensive order during one of their sales, asked if I could tag on another disc at regular price that I forgot [to avoid another shipping, and they explicitly stated yes. I emailed back with the disc title the next day and maybe they could send me a paypal invoice or promo code or let me know what to do, days went buy, order not shipped, no response etc. Finally I got a response stating that they would not tag on another disc, contradicting themself. I replied simply that I emailed before and that is was 'poor form' to state they would, waste a customers time delaying order for a week and the change 'their mind.' The manager then decided to cancel my entire order. Hours of my time, were spent browsing and ordering.
SCREENARCHIVES
Here is the most ridiculous latest and it is in regard to basic integrity 101.
factors:
- paid 2x shipping cost of actual
- bought 2 simply discs, one the day after their sale for regular price
- so there is a big money stake already on buyer who would expect some consideration in packing and especially since it was grade D+, if any issue, period, some offered paid return or replacement, such as a simple square cut bluray case. Their cost, fractional of what I paid.
ScreenArchives (The agent I had the insulting misfortune of dealing with was named Katie) is the example of this grade D- seller with an F attitude and zero integrity. Not only did they have no integrity but their reply and excuses were warped, dishonest, irrational, which only leads me to believe that she was aware and intentionally sent the item in non-perfect aka cracked condtion. What I was served was a big baloney and cheese sandwich.
I was sent a clear visably physically damaged bluray (a big crack in case molding on top, not external as from any ahipping damage) (from manufacture, not shipping was poor, minimal) in a direct, expensive order with shipping charge that was double of what constitutes their cost.
I decided to email them considering cost as a first (and last) time customer simply asking for a replacement case. As a vendor, they of course have plenty of spare cases and what I even paid in excess for shipping would certainly cover it.
But also given their obvious error, you would think they would have the common expected courtesy and consideration as human being. Nope. I also tried over 2 weeks with around 5-6 emails to give them a chance so that I might continue ordering and not burn any bridge but after 3 insulting replies, it was obvious they had to intention towards integrity at any step after I informed them of their error.
Here ridiculous, insult reponses,
MY EMAIL: The copy you sent me of SOME-BLURAY-CASE was cracked - not from shipping, but embedded... (a manufacture defect)
SCREENARCHIVES: I am very sorry the postal system was so rough on the package to cause damage. We only send items in perfect condition. We do not send cases along on their own as they never arrive in one piece. If you could include a note within the notes field of you next order we can send a new blue blu-ray case for you.
[sounds like an amazon chatbot, doesn't it? completely disregards what human customer says]
- Untrue. i clearly stated not from shipping but damage as stated was manufacture defect, clearly visible, sent with damage. ignored my statement as well as additional info (i retailed media for a solid decade in a big city store pushing of pieces of media thousands a day, including FILM SCORE MAG in the 1990s-early 2000s!)
- Rationality point: ok. hmm. i am going to drop another $50+ and 8.50 shipping just to get my case. ok. hmm. i am going to trust you again with that reply!
- The fact that agent Katie would try to coerce me to place another order is extremely bad form.
- One point i mentioned i could take photo, etc. ignored.
"We do not send cases along on their own as they never arrive in one piece."
Logic point #2. First this makes zero sense. She sent 2 blurays, flimsy flexible pieces of soft plastic not prone to cracking under basic minimal protection. Neither broke or were cracked in my order FROM SHIPPING (the one only from factory defect or pre-existing absolutely). The only DIFFERENCE between an empty bluray case and a case with a disc in it, is the disc! The disc that has absolutely zero effect on whether a soft flexible plastic bluray case/shell would crack in transit. ScreenArchives *could* actually take some care in packing to basically ensure they would arrive safe in any case. Zero excuse, in fact totally ridiculous clear deflection.
MY EMAIL: (I emailed in response to just send me the case, re-iterated that the damage was not from shipping, it was pre-existing and i could take photo to proof it, and just pressed her to send the case..)
- a gap of 1 week after initial email and response hoping i might just disappear.
(no response for something like a week, and then...)
SCREENARCHIVES/KATIE: Your temper tantrum over cheap plastic is ridiculous. I said we will send you a new case in your next order as we do not send them along on their own.... We are not scamming you out of anything sh*t just happens.
"Sh*t just happens." Wow, and now I am having a temper trantrum from buying 2 pieces of soft plastic + 2 dics for a premium price with ultra-premium shipping AND that was clearly sent damaged pre-shipment and asking for a case!!
It is plain as day, that she had no intention of sending a replacement case, or resolving in any other manner, such as paid return, etc, if ScreenArchives had to lose "time and money" (see final reply below!) for their error.
Absolutely incredible. What an insult. Let's make a checklist of what makes a good seller, an honest seller, a considerate seller by action and word, and most important basic integrity--- you find zero here.
SIDENOTE - SERVICE VERSUS BEING SERVED (A BALONEY SANDWICH)
I clerked for many years behind a register and in trade service. I also remember in the 2000s when all-the-sudden you'd go to a restaurant and the young waiters and waitresses might start giving you attitude like you are their to serve them and what a hassle you for expect them to get you a refill.
Perfect example of a spoiled, ungrateful, dishonest seller with no integrity, no service and who can simply get away with it because - they know it's easier to just lie and blow off via email, hope that person goes away, and when they don't (like me), they say you're having a tantrum.
The buyer screwed unless they pay out of pocket for seller mistake and then BABYSIT tracking numbers, loss of time and hassle for a stupid case. Nobody likes to be ROBBED.
SCREENARCHIVES FINAL RESPONSE - EOD.
AGENT KATIE'S FINAL RESPONSE: I told you we do not send them along on their own as they always arrive damaged. We are not going to waste our time and money to send a case alone when it will only arrive broken. End of discussion.
OK, so buyer gets nothing. sorry Charlie. ScreenArchives "ARE NOT GOING TO WASTE [THEIR] TIME AND MONEY."
Even though, it's not their money. It is mine. I was sent an item 50% of common market value at minimum. They pocketed and kept 50% of shipping a pure profit. No replacement that would cost them nothing to sent that they already have been paid for, and nothing. Customer gets insulted, ignored, lied to - "end of discussion.""
Pure deceit, fraud and theft.
"End of discussion."
I hope these stories aid and give the good sellers out there some food for thought on rationality, integrity and basic consideration, as well as a cautionary tale for buyers.
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......Kind of makes one nostalgic for the old days of brick & mortar record stores, don't it?
YES, it does. Personally working in this area of selling FILM SCORE and varied media was a good time in my life from the other end of the counter as well.
The attitude in sales and service has changed. It's all about values. In Brick and Mortar, it was crucial to take care of both merchandise and customers in order to succeed.
But, I greatly miss especially going to the old cd/vinyl shop that had an owner with pretty mainstream taste but he was smart enough to care all the speciality music, various genres and ost. And if there was a small problem, big deal, here you go, and thank you, please shop again. Guess what the result is?
I am nowhere near dying, but brick-and-mortar is already a dying wish. I guess that is nostalgia. If one day I can spend a weekend afternoon in a shop browsing, I will damn well appreciate it
Interesting point, when we shop online especially with all these specialty retailers and shop for discs, we kind of put our trust in them. Not always easy to tell who is legit or is reliable.
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