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 Posted:   Dec 17, 2020 - 3:12 AM   
 By:   johnbijl   (Member)

And yeah, I pretty much don't touch the CD after the first listen, it's true. But I'd rather have a rip I made myself that I know is actually representative of the disc, done properly.

The funny thing is though, that your rip is a copy (of a copy, of a copy). The downloaded file is far more original and far less proned to errors than a cd-rip.

 
 Posted:   Dec 17, 2020 - 3:21 AM   
 By:   johnbijl   (Member)

The value of a CD is in the item ITSELF. It's a matter of collecting it, it's about the feeling of having it and then enjoy it as a thing you can put physically in a player. Some of us will never EVER buy intangible digital files.

The 16-bit or 24-bit talking is irrelevant, because you don't hear it, you just KNOW it! The analogy with the scanner is also stupid. You don't make a picture of anything and say you use it.


There's no logic in this, and that's fine. As a human being your entitled to have irrational viewing points. Your clinging to physical objects is your prerogative — but the value you ascribe to it subjective. Or as Dana puts it: sentiment. The truth is, that the cd, booklet and case are less than one percent of the production costs.

As other have said already, there's nothing wrong with you preferring the proces of someone printing a cd for you, rather than having direct acces to the music. But it's not necessary to call arguments stupid because your preference is different.

 
 Posted:   Dec 17, 2020 - 3:27 AM   
 By:   Nicolai P. Zwar   (Member)

And yeah, I pretty much don't touch the CD after the first listen, it's true. But I'd rather have a rip I made myself that I know is actually representative of the disc, done properly.

The funny thing is though, that your rip is a copy (of a copy, of a copy). The downloaded file is far more original and far less proned to errors than a cd-rip.


That is not necessarily so. With tools like EAC and Accurate Rip, which do bit-for-bit comparison, you can be rest assured that your copy is 1:1 and bit for bit identical to what the files are supposed to contain.

 
 Posted:   Dec 17, 2020 - 3:41 AM   
 By:   Nicolai P. Zwar   (Member)

The value of a CD is in the item ITSELF. It's a matter of collecting it, it's about the feeling of having it and then enjoy it as a thing you can put physically in a player. Some of us will never EVER buy intangible digital files.

The 16-bit or 24-bit talking is irrelevant, because you don't hear it, you just KNOW it! The analogy with the scanner is also stupid. You don't make a picture of anything and say you use it.


There's no logic in this, and that's fine. As a human being your entitled to have irrational viewing points. Your clinging to physical objects is your prerogative — but the value you ascribe to it subjective. Or as Dana puts it: sentiment. The truth is, that the cd, booklet and case are less than one percent of the production costs.

As other have said already, there's nothing wrong with you preferring the proces of someone printing a cd for you, rather than having direct acces to the music. But it's not necessary to call arguments stupid because your preference is different.




Indeed. I mean, it is not "stupid" to want and enjoy a physical disc, that is perfectly okay. But on the other hand, there are those who do not need any more physical discs. And that is a logical step forward, and by no means "stupid". One may say the theoretically better sound quality is "irrelevant", because you can't hear it, and that's fine, but you could also say the physical disc is irrelevant, because who needs it? It serves no purpose anymore. At least it serves no purpose to me. Some may get a joy of holding a physical disc, some don't. And that's fine as far as I'm concerned. Heck, I got enough discs already -- some in nice editions -- if I ever want to feel the joy of holding a CD. Nowadays, I feel much happier if I get high-res files for the same money, because I am more than happy to trade (even if it is just theoretical) better sound quality for not having to fill up more shelf space with plastic.

 
 
 Posted:   Dec 17, 2020 - 5:08 AM   
 By:   Spymaster   (Member)

For me it's about the experience of listening.

Digital music didn't click with me until I bought a NAS (Synology 218+) and a high-quality network player (Cambridge Audio CXN-2) (not cheap investments!) I can now play lossless FLACS (16 and 24-bit) files through the same system as my CDs. The experience of listening is the same. In fact my aging eyes can now read track titles properly! If there's a digital booklet then even better (the absence of good artwork, liner notes and credits is a significant loss, especially for film music where the tone of the music is often closely linked to the tone of the film stills)

And now I can also stream in real time from my NAS to my phone, or download to my phone (from anywhere in the world!) for listening on the go.

The idea of storing digital files on my laptop and listening through computer speakers is still a major no-no!

And if there is a pressed CD I sill, nearly always, go that route. These is still something very nice about having that physical "relationship". Similarly I would never, ever buy a book digitally.

 
 
 Posted:   Dec 17, 2020 - 5:19 AM   
 By:   TerraEpon   (Member)


The funny thing is though, that your rip is a copy (of a copy, of a copy). The downloaded file is far more original and far less proned to errors than a cd-rip.


Well that's about as ignorant as a post as I've read on this board in a while. And that's saying something.

 
 Posted:   Dec 17, 2020 - 5:23 AM   
 By:   Nicolai P. Zwar   (Member)



The idea of storing digital files on my laptop and listening through computer speakers is still a major no-no!


Oh, yes, absolutely. I don't listen to music through my computer speakers.

Like your, my files are on my NAS system (which I intend to replace/upgrade next year) and played via a streamer on my hifi system. I use the computer to curate the collection, not to play the files.

 
 Posted:   Dec 17, 2020 - 5:33 AM   
 By:   Nicolai P. Zwar   (Member)

Of course, if your laptop has a digital out and your hifi system has a digital in, you could use your PC as a player and still get the full power of your hifi system without the need for a NAS..

 
 
 Posted:   Dec 17, 2020 - 8:33 AM   
 By:   AJL   (Member)

Surely the reason many collectors of film music, especially older ones like myself, will continue to buy CDs is because they do not want to buy the expensive components necessary to play digital files through their Hi-Fi systems. Also, if their interest in music is largely confined to film music, as mine is, then Hi-Res digital is for the future, not for now when relatively few scores are available in the new format. Digital is fine for those who have 30 or more years collecting in front of them. For those of us who have a lot fewer, and for the reasons above, CDs will remain our format of choice.

 
 Posted:   Dec 17, 2020 - 8:42 AM   
 By:   johnbijl   (Member)

Surely the reason many collectors of film music, especially older ones like myself, will continue to buy CDs is because they do not want to buy the expensive components necessary to play digital files through their Hi-Fi systems.

You can buy a Bluetooth music receiver for under 50 dollar, which connects your computer to any music system.

 
 Posted:   Dec 17, 2020 - 9:10 AM   
 By:   Col. Flagg   (Member)

You can buy a Bluetooth music receiver for under 50 dollar, which connects your computer to any music system.

Bluetooth is sub-Hifi.

 
 
 Posted:   Dec 17, 2020 - 9:12 AM   
 By:   Hurdy Gurdy   (Member)

Good point about the age of listeners and consumers.
I'm at the stage now where I have so much great music, by my favourite composers, I can sit back and cherish my CD collection, built up over the last 33 years or so.
I still look forward to a new release or expansion that rocks my boat, and fortunately, labels are still releasing scores on CD for my delectation.
And CD has had a pretty good innings.
I don't think the CD format will disappear completely.
Like vinyl, too many people still favour it and will keep it alive, albeit as a niche market.
But I will never fall for the digital download format ever.
Like others have stated, there is a 'to have and to hold' quality to CD that appeals to me.
I have Spotify for free, forever, as an original subscriber and most new stuff ends up on YouTube too.
I don't see much difference between those options and virtual downloads that can also be 'acquired' from various sources.

 
 Posted:   Dec 17, 2020 - 9:20 AM   
 By:   Solium   (Member)

I think the music companies are cutting off their noses to spite their face. I bet they make a lot more money licensing out a score to a CD producer than they do by simply putting the digital files online. Especially since we know a great deal of ppl illegally download. The physical soundtrack product is where its at.

 
 
 Posted:   Dec 17, 2020 - 9:24 AM   
 By:   OnyaBirri   (Member)

There is no reason for anyone who would buy a CD to not buy a hi-res download. They are at least CD quality and arguably better.

If any physical-media-only holdouts want to boycott hi-res downloads, it is their loss. The rest of us will enjoy them.

 
 
 Posted:   Dec 17, 2020 - 10:16 AM   
 By:   .   (Member)


Like others have stated, there is a 'to have and to hold' quality to CD that appeals to me.



If CDs came in clear plastic envelopes with no paperwork or artwork, where would be the pleasure in owning and holding it?
It is the accompanying material that is desirable, not the actual disc.
As downloads develop further, it is inevitable that labels will be forced to develop supplementary packages that make their offerings more desirable in terms of collectability. Just because a physical disc of thin plastic isn't present does not mean some other form of desirable package can't be made available. Maybe think in terms of concert programs – there's no disc with those, but they are certainly collectible. Why couldn't a label like Deutsche Grammophon or EMI or Sony make both downloadable AND physical programs/librettos available? Cost? It could be a money-making exercise for the labels with relevant sponsorship/advertising incorporated (again, like you'd see in any concert program). For sure, going forward they won't be content to simply see their recordings listed in a bland way on some third-party download site. They'll still have to market their wares and they will certainly find a way to tempt us.

 
 Posted:   Dec 17, 2020 - 10:34 AM   
 By:   Nicolai P. Zwar   (Member)

Well, it seems Intrada's release for INCHON should please everybody then: there is a CD and a high-res download, and everyone is free to choose.

 
 
 Posted:   Dec 17, 2020 - 10:52 AM   
 By:   Hurdy Gurdy   (Member)

Yes, I meant the overall physical CD package.
The disc, booklet, case.
There's a great joy to ripping open the shrink wrap, opening the case and playing the CD and reading the booklet notes and perusing the stills.
A download to me is the same as a listen on Spotify or YouTube and most of them I have I still burn to CDR to obtain a physical copy for future listens or transfer to portable players.
We're are all into this for our own personal pleasure.

 
 Posted:   Dec 17, 2020 - 11:04 AM   
 By:   johnbijl   (Member)

You can buy a Bluetooth music receiver for under 50 dollar, which connects your computer to any music system.

Bluetooth is sub-Hifi.


With modern bluetooth, the right codec and a good D/A-converter like in the 150 euro iFi Zen: hardly. Especially in regular rooms (as in: non-special listing rooms). For most people the Marmitek BoomBoom 80 or one from Logitech will do the job -- especially with regular mastered ALAC of FLAC. Both are wel under 50 dollars.

 
 
 Posted:   Dec 17, 2020 - 11:20 AM   
 By:   Spymaster   (Member)

If any physical-media-only holdouts want to boycott hi-res downloads, it is their loss. The rest of us will enjoy them.

Having done a quick scan across the classical hi-res downloads at Presto Music, it seems like the vast majority have digital booklets. So why is the soundtrack market not keeping pace?

 
 Posted:   Dec 17, 2020 - 12:34 PM   
 By:   Sean Nethery   (Member)

Surely the reason many collectors of film music, especially older ones like myself, will continue to buy CDs is because they do not want to buy the expensive components necessary to play digital files through their Hi-Fi systems. Also, if their interest in music is largely confined to film music, as mine is, then Hi-Res digital is for the future, not for now when relatively few scores are available in the new format. Digital is fine for those who have 30 or more years collecting in front of them. For those of us who have a lot fewer, and for the reasons above, CDs will remain our format of choice.

True for some, not for all. For instance:

I have been collecting lps, 8-tracks, cassettes and many thousands of CDs over the past 47 years.

And I embrace digital wholeheartedly now, in part very much because I do not have another 47 years of collecting ahead of me.

I expect to eliminate my physical CD collection over the next 10 years, so that my uninterested family doesn't have to worry about it when I check out. (If I check out sooner, well, I guess they'll have to deal, sue me.)

But I also love digital for convenience, for having many hundreds of my favorite recordings ready to play on my phone or bluetooth speakers, and for the many many thousands of albums and artists available to me for a modest monthly cost on streaming platforms.

I also don't care about high res, and don't find enough difference between CD audio and decent mp3s to worry about it. So for me we are living in the best time EVER for music listening.

VERY glad Intrada is upgrading to hi res digital when they can. And glad for those who want them to still have the opportunity for CDs.

Oh, and when there is something I want and it's only available as a CD, yes, I will buy it! But only then.

 
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