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Received my package yesterday after ordering from the international shop (I live in Belgium) and had to pay an additional 34,59 euro (!!!!) taxes! This didn't happen last time when I ordered 'Along came a Spider'. So this CD cost me 67,01 euro. Stupid brexit.
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Received my package yesterday after ordering from the international shop (I live in Belgium) and had to pay an additional 34,59 euro (!!!!) taxes! This didn't happen last time when I ordered 'Along came a Spider'. So this CD cost me 67,01 euro. Stupid brexit.
Yes, I had the same experience when ordering from "Varèse International", which should be renamed "Varèse UK", as it is actually cheaper now to import CDs from the US into the EU than it is from the UK. Brexit makes ordering anything from the UK prohibitively expensive.
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Received my package yesterday after ordering from the international shop (I live in Belgium) and had to pay an additional 34,59 euro (!!!!) taxes! This didn't happen last time when I ordered 'Along came a Spider'. So this CD cost me 67,01 euro. Stupid brexit.
My copy arrived without a problem in the Netherlands luckily. This does make me a bit wary for my next order
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I love Varese and will always support it, but, geez, it really need a better quality control over its products...
This!
"And I worry about Quality Control because without it, quality will get out of hand." - Lily Tomlin
I mean jeeze, if I didn't occasionally browse this message board I'd never have known there was an issue.
So much for notifying your customers who already ordered.
James
You have the option to stop ordering and move on my friend 
Well you worked at Varese once and still seem to defend the nonsense that goes on even in a new regime. You think them not contacting their customers about this is okay?
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Unless a glitch in the listing changed the price temporarily. Did you order at $19.95 and are now being charged more ? 
No, it was originally $19.98 for the first 3-4 days and then the price increased $5.
It was a subtle change, but we noticed around May 3/4 and Nicolai P. Zwar posted on May 4th:
The price was bumped up from $19.99 to first $24.99 and then $31.99 because of the high cost of "track research".
The quote is slightly erroneous as I think this poster was joking about "track research", and his mention of $31.99 was conflating what a Canadian poster had observed (in Canadian dollars).
But there was definitely a price increase in that short time span from $19.98 USD to $24.98 USD.
I was slow to purchase and felt $19.98 was an acceptable price for a score I had never heard to a movie I had never seen, and I remember feeling less enthused when the price went up. But I still purchased anyway!
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Unless a glitch in the listing changed the price temporarily. Did you order at $19.95 and are now being charged more ?
No, it was originally $19.98 for the first 3-4 days and then the price increased $5.
It was a subtle change, but we noticed around May 3/4 and Nicolai P. Zwar posted on May 4th:
The price was bumped up from $19.99 to first $24.99 and then $31.99 because of the high cost of "track research".
The quote is slightly erroneous as I think this poster was joking about "track research", and his mention of $31.99 was conflating what a Canadian poster had observed (in Canadian dollars).
But there was definitely a price increase in that short time span from $19.98 USD to $24.98 USD.
I was slow to purchase and felt $19.98 was an acceptable price for a score I had never heard to a movie I had never seen, and I remember feeling less enthused when the price went up. But I still purchased anyway!
This whole release is a dumpster fire.
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On the announcement date of April 30th the price at the Varese website was $24.99, not $19.99. That's the price which my order states. If someone tried to order it indirectly from a different site, Varese couldn't be responsible for another vendor's typo. As of today, though, they are accepting orders again for a June 18th shipping date.
Further, I suspect the reprinting glitch is not due entirely to one spine miscrediting "Lionheart" as composer, but a need to credit Robert Townson properly. (But I think the modified booklet art with that same substitution is hilarious!)
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I hate to bust the crock pot here, but Track 1 and Track 2 should be reversed. THE CEREMONY happens before THE CASTLE. In fact, in the film, the second part of THE CASTLE is pasted to the end of THE CEREMONY. THE CEREMONY seems to be a better way to open the album, musically, unless you want to attempt to recreate the cut and paste job in the film by taking the second part of THE FUTURE, crossfading to THE CEREMONY, and ending with the second part of THE CASTLE. I don't think that would sound good on an album, so just switching cues 1 and 2 would work fine for an album. I think there is still music in that opening cut and paste job that I don't remember being on the original two volumes, so it makes no sense to even try an re-create it editorially.
Very
MaxB
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Posted: |
May 8, 2021 - 4:51 PM
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By: |
Spymaster
(Member)
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I hate to bust the crock pot here, but Track 1 and Track 2 should be reversed. THE CEREMONY happens before THE CASTLE. In fact, in the film, the second part of THE CASTLE is pasted to the end of THE CEREMONY. THE CEREMONY seems to be a better way to open the album, musically, unless you want to attempt to recreate the cut and paste job in the film by taking the second part of THE FUTURE, crossfading to THE CEREMONY, and ending with the second part of THE CASTLE. I don't think that would sound good on an album, so just switching cues 1 and 2 would work fine for an album. I think there is still music in that opening cut and paste job that I don't remember being on the original two volumes, so it makes no sense to even try an re-create it editorially.
Very
MaxB
The Castle was intended as the Main Title before it was replaced by a cut/paste of Robert's Theme from the end of the film. The AMPAS score sheets indicate this.
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And Doug Fake’s copy (made at the original sessions back in 1986) of the entire score also has “Main Title (The Castle)” as the first cue and “The Ceremony” as the second. That’s how they were in the original longer cut of the film that Jerry scored, and that’s the order he intended them in (otherwise Doug would have had them in a different order).
You want to be faithful to what’s in the hacked up final cut of the film? Then you’re also going to have to omit four cues entirely (plus 90% of Robert and Blanche), plus you’re going to have to hack and slash all but two cues that made it into the film (believe me, it’s a mess and David painstakingly figured it all out).
My “track research” vision behind the final album track order I recommended to Varese was all about being faithful to how Jerry wrote and originally conceived his score, not being faithful to how the final cut of the film (horribly) treated it. You want to swap those two cues in your iTunes and add an edit of the End Credits to the beginning, feel free...
Yavar
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For anyone curious, here’s a scan of Doug’s dupe tape from the sessions which gave us the two new cues... and also confirms what we already knew from the written sketches in the Academy’s Margaret Herrick Library: that “The Castle” was written and intended as the Main Title (and first cue), despite it appearing (in truncated form) in the final cut of the film after “The Ceremony” (in truncated form) and an edit of Jerry’s End Credits cue being used as the main title music instead...
Oh, and here are Jerry’s written sketches which already told me the correct order before I even got confirmation from Doug’s scan. Now maybe y’all who are giving me a hard time for my “track research” credit on this can give it a rest, since obviously there were clearly some complicated things to be figured out for this release? To be honest this is really only the tip of the iceberg when it comes to complex stuff that had to be figured out with this score, on minimal surviving documentation.
http://collections.new.oscars.org/Details/Archive/71302978
I spent a long time working on this (again, at no cost to Varese and Steven is 100% correct that the album was NEVER up for $19.99 so I don’t know where that is coming from...probably someone trying to make a joke or stir the pot). Rest assured I debated a lot of options in terms of track order and presentation (bouncing many of them off my Goldsmith Odyssey colleagues) and this order was not a goof or sloppily stumbled upon. We considered matching the film. We concluded given that the final cut of it treated Jerry’s music horribly (and also hardly anyone has even seen the movie anyway) that following Jerry’s original order when he wrote the score for the earlier cut was the way to go.
Now I really understand why people at the labels don’t like to hang out here much. The complaints, nitpicks, and general Monday morning quarterbacking are just so exhausting. Maybe try giving the people who work on something just a bit more benefit of the doubt? None of them are doing this to get rich (even the ones who are paid, lol).
(Meanwhile I recognize that many here have been supportive and kind rather than critical — I see you all, and I appreciate you.)
Yavar
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Yeah, it’s just speculation but I wouldn’t be a bit surprised if the final cut wasn’t done by Schaffner (just like what happened on the first film of his scored by Jerry, The Stripper, come to think of it.) There are too many cuts that are just too clumsy for an established veteran like Schaffner, IMO. And personally I can see plenty of hints of the great movie this could have been (plenty of very assured shots where Schaffner’s talent as a director comes through), if there had been say a different leading man and another pass at the script...at least Jerry delivered a score for the film this could have been rather than the film it ended up as. Gabriel Byrne as the villainous Black Prince in particular is a high point of the movie and I think he was actually acting in that imaginary “better” version of the film that Jerry scored, if that makes any sense. (And I’m not like some big fan of Byrne’s in general or anything, either.)
Yavar
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Posted: |
May 8, 2021 - 6:59 PM
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By: |
MCurry29
(Member)
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For anyone curious, here’s a scan of Doug’s dupe tape from the sessions which gave us the two new cues... and also confirms what we already knew from the written sketches in the Academy’s Margaret Herrick Library: that “The Castle” was written and intended as the Main Title (and first cue), despite it appearing (in truncated form) in the final cut of the film after “The Ceremony” (in truncated form) and an edit of Jerry’s End Credits cue being used as the main title music instead...
Oh, and here are Jerry’s written sketches which already told me the correct order before I even got confirmation from Doug’s scan. Now maybe y’all who are giving me a hard time for my “track research” credit on this can give it a rest, since obviously there were clearly some complicated things to be figured out for this release? To be honest this is really only the tip of the iceberg when it comes to complex stuff that had to be figured out with this score, on minimal surviving documentation.
http://collections.new.oscars.org/Details/Archive/71302978
I spent a long time working on this (again, at no cost to Varese and Steven is 100% correct that the album was NEVER up for $19.99 so I don’t know where that is coming from...probably someone trying to make a joke or stir the pot). Rest assured I debated a lot of options in terms of track order and presentation (bouncing many of them off my Goldsmith Odyssey colleagues) and this order was not a goof or sloppily stumbled upon. We considered matching the film. We concluded given that the final cut of it treated Jerry’s music horribly (and also hardly anyone has even seen the movie anyway) that following Jerry’s original order when he wrote the score for the earlier cut was the way to go.
Now I really understand why people at the labels don’t like to hang out here much. The complaints, nitpicks, and general Monday morning quarterbacking are just so exhausting. Maybe try giving the people who work on something just a bit more benefit of the doubt? None of them are doing this to get rich (even the ones who are paid, lol).
(Meanwhile I recognize that many here have been supportive and kind rather than critical — I see you all, and I appreciate you.)
Yavar
Kudos Yavar! I love what you've written here.
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