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 Posted:   Jul 26, 2011 - 10:53 AM   
 By:   Superman   (Member)

As the other few Willow threads quickly devolved into "classical music" and "Lord of the Rings" discussions for OBVIOUS reasons, I'll start a fresh one focusing on the fact that:

I would LOVE to see this one complete & remastered(c&c) one day. Even ONE as yet unreleased, classic Horner cue/track would be worth the price of entry here. For example:

The Snow-Shield Escape & Snowball
Raziel's Island
Airk's Galadorrn Army Approaches
Brownie Attack & Welcome to My Kingdom
Sorsha's Tent

The new Krull has been tops!!


NP: Intrada's Remo Williams (well in my mind, anyway big grin)

 
 
 Posted:   Jul 26, 2011 - 11:07 AM   
 By:   nxbusby491   (Member)

I second that! I also would like a high def Bluray special edition!

 
 
 Posted:   Jul 26, 2011 - 11:57 AM   
 By:   Luc Van der Eeken   (Member)

You have my vote! Best Horner score ever IMO...

 
 Posted:   Jul 26, 2011 - 12:00 PM   
 By:   Maestro   (Member)

I second that! I also would like a high def Bluray special edition!

I'd love to see this on Blu too. Great score!!

 
 
 Posted:   Jul 26, 2011 - 1:42 PM   
 By:   TerraEpon   (Member)

I'd buy a 2CD set of it in a heartbeat.

But this is one score I've seen frequent mention of it being too long.

The album DOES annoy me, but only in that the cues themselves are so damn long. I'd love if this ever does get a reissue/expansion for the tracks to be broken up a bit (which emphatically does NOT mean there would be any gaps in the music)

 
 Posted:   Jul 26, 2011 - 1:55 PM   
 By:   scottyboipdx   (Member)

I would not hesitate to buy an expanded/complete edition...one of my top 10 fave scores of all time.

 
 Posted:   Jul 26, 2011 - 2:18 PM   
 By:   LeHah   (Member)

Love this score (particularly, strangely, the lovely folk source music in the Dikini village) and would snap up an expanded copy in an instant.

 
 Posted:   Jul 26, 2011 - 2:31 PM   
 By:   Superman   (Member)

I'd love if this ever does get a reissue/expansion for the tracks to be broken up a bit (which emphatically does NOT mean there would be any gaps in the music)


I quite liked the long, suite-like tracks, however, I would go for broken up tracks as long as they were separated properly as you mention.

 
 
 Posted:   Jul 26, 2011 - 2:55 PM   
 By:   gregorioumbria   (Member)

As the other few Willow threads quickly devolved into "classical music" and "Lord of the Rings" discussions for OBVIOUS reasons, I'll start a fresh one focusing on the fact that:

I would LOVE to see this one complete & remastered(c&c) one day. Even ONE as yet unreleased, classic Horner cue/track would be worth the price of entry here. For example:

The Snow-Shield Escape & Snowball
Raziel's Island
Airk's Galadorrn Army Approaches
Brownie Attack & Welcome to My Kingdom
Sorsha's Tent

The new Krull has been tops!!


NP: Intrada's Remo Williams (well in my mind, anyway big grin)


+1

 
 
 Posted:   Jul 26, 2011 - 3:34 PM   
 By:   Avatarded   (Member)

There are actually enough gaps of silence where the music stops in the longer cues that make them easy to split. So easy it's almost safe to assume that the long cues were indeed recorded separately and then just cut together in suite form.

I took the album and split it into 14 tracks, and had people more familiar with the film than I am help me in naming them.
I saw the film once and couldn't stand it so there was no way I was going to revisit it to give them proper names. It was back in 2003 or so. It was on TV late Sunday night and I saw some of it and had to turn it off, it's just bad (to me).

Maybe one day I'll cave and see it again just to hear the music in context but I'm in no rush.

My tracklist is as follows:

1. Elora Danan (untouched)

2. Escape From The Tavern (untouched)

3. Willow's Journey Begins (untouched)

4. Canyon of Mazes (untouched)

5. Tir Asleen segment 1: The Battle Begins (4:23)

6. Tir Asleen segment 2: The Dragon Attacks (1:40)

7. Tir Asleen segment 3: Madmartigan vs. The Dragon (4:46)

8. Willow's Theme (untouched)

9. Bavmorda's Spell Is Cast segment 1 (1:23)

10. Bavmorda segment 2: Raziel's Transformation / The Ritual (8:18)

11. Bavmorda segment 3: Assault on Bavmorda's Castle (2:43)

12. Bavmorda segment 4: Confronting Bavmorda (2:05)

13. Bavmorda segment 5: Defeating General Kael (3:47)

14. Willow The Sorcerer (untouched)

So all I did was take the 10+ minute cues "Tir Asleen" and "Bavmorda's Spell is Cast", loaded them into a WAV editor and split them up according to silence gaps. Each one naturally had its own proper beginning and ending without having to alter them at all.

 
 
 Posted:   Jul 26, 2011 - 6:02 PM   
 By:   TerraEpon   (Member)

()

 
 
 Posted:   Jul 26, 2011 - 6:02 PM   
 By:   TerraEpon   (Member)

Willow's Theme could probably be moved too, perhaps to the beginning.

But thanks for this though. I may just do some audaciated editing...

 
 
 Posted:   Jul 26, 2011 - 7:36 PM   
 By:   Avatarded   (Member)

I have no idea what the chronological order for the score is at all, or if its even in order. I suppose if the longer cues are split and they weren't originally played in that order in the film, then it could be a fun activity to shuffle it around for a better listening experience.

 
 
 Posted:   Jul 26, 2011 - 7:45 PM   
 By:   Shock-Wave   (Member)

It would be great to have a complete score to Willow. I also LOVE the extended folk music played during the Dikini festival. But since G. Lucas is involved won't it be difficult to release an expanded and/or complete sdtk? Also Virgin Records owns the rights I believe.

Sorry I don't mean to sound negative folks. However I am crossing my fingers for a future release.

 
 Posted:   Jul 27, 2011 - 9:52 AM   
 By:   Josh "Swashbuckler" Gizelt   (Member)

This thread inspired me to revisit the score. I remember seeing the film when it came out and thinking it was rather lame, but I immediately recognized James Horner's style from his two Star Trek films even before his credit appeared in the film. I haven't seen it in some time, so I don't know how well it has aged or if the chemistry between Val Kilmer and Joanne Whalley is still fresh.

Oddly enough, I never really warmed up to the soundtrack album. I say "oddly" because I have just listened to it all the way through and found it completely engaging from front to back. I don't just like the themes, but how they fit together and lead into one another. I would grab a complete version of this score in an instant, as I think this type of writing tends to lend itself to that sort of presentation (then again, I'm addicted to the complete Krull, so take that into account).

In the meantime, if somebody could post the chronological order for the soundtrack selections, I would be most grateful, as I feel that there were certain decisions made for programmatic reasons (such as the placement of "Escape from the Tavern" to introduce the heroic theme earlier in the album) that jar somewhat against the narrative style the score employs.

I understand that the track order was different on the vinyl ("Willow's Journey Begins" headed off side two?). From the listing I saw, side one would to add up to about 33 minutes, side two about 35½ minutes. How did they manage squeeze all that onto a single platter without it starting to sound terrible (or did it)?

 
 
 Posted:   Jul 27, 2011 - 11:13 AM   
 By:   bobbengan   (Member)

First off: I too like this score a great deal and would love an expanded edition. There's a ton of worthwhile music that didn't make it onto the original album.

Secondly - I know it's gotten tiresome to hear the Horner-plagiarism-bashing thing, but in the case of WILLOW I find it annoying because it's not just a set-pieces or a secondary motif he stole - it's the scores two primary identities!!! That's inexcusable. Same goes for LAND BEFORE TIME.

That's why I can forgive KRULL (in my opinion the best score Horner's ever written), because while the bad guy ostinato may be a clear rip from Holst's MARS, his primary ideas are so vividly heroic and of his own voice (even if the main theme was clearly somewhat inspired by Humperdink's WITCH'S RIDE from his HANSEL & GRETEL opera, but note that I say 'inspired' and not 'stolen') that I can forgive this, as Krull has so many brilliantly stunning set pieces and inspired moments (including one of the most staggeringly beautiful love themes ever written in my opinion) that I am liable to forgive there.

With WILLOW, THE LAND BEFORE TIME and GLORY it's annoying that all or most of his primary ideas aren't his own, but approximated from other composers...that said, I do enjoy WILLOW too much to really care too deeply...just a few thoughts...

 
 
 Posted:   Jul 27, 2011 - 1:41 PM   
 By:   TerraEpon   (Member)

You know, people always bring up Willow as one of Horner's 'worst' steals but I wonder if it IS because of its primary spot in the score? I've listened to both Willow's Theme and Schumann's 3rd Symphony many times and while yes they are similar the former is hardly a direct rip off of the later. If nothing else, Schumann is very pompous whereas Willow's Theme is rousing....is that makes sense. They are different stylistically and it's mainly about five notes worth that are actually exactly the same.

Sometimes the Horner bashing makes me think of this: http://www.northernsounds.com/forum/showthread.php/39422-Brahms-First-Symphony

 
 Posted:   Jul 27, 2011 - 1:55 PM   
 By:   LeHah   (Member)

that said, I do enjoy WILLOW too much to really care too deeply...

Exactly my thoughts as well. The movie is ingrained into my childhood - I think I watched this only every several years, terrified of the weird dragon the troll transformed into and loving Val Kilmer's brash Han Solo Lite swagger - so I give it a free pass despite some issues, the score being a child of a famous symphony being one of them...

 
 Posted:   Jul 27, 2011 - 3:37 PM   
 By:   Josh "Swashbuckler" Gizelt   (Member)

The arguments of the borrows and lifts are inevitable, but even if Horner is a little more blatant with it than others, in the end there are few composers that can't be said of anyway. It just goes 'round and 'round and 'round. Besides, I'll take a James Horner score that's derivative but stamped with his own definite musical personality over a dull, background "paint-by-numbers" score any day.

 
 
 Posted:   Jul 27, 2011 - 5:38 PM   
 By:   swayland7   (Member)

With all due respect to plagiarism, I also very much enjoy this score (and the film). For those interested, the chronological order of tracks is:

1. Elora Danan
2. Willow's Journey Begins
3. Escape from the Tavern
4. Canyon of Mazes
5. Tir Asleen
6. Bavmorda's Spell is Cast
7. Willow the Sorcerer

"Willow's Theme" is, of course, a concert arrangement which also appears within "Willow the Sorcerer." There is indeed a lot of great music from the film that has never been released. If we could just get the music for Chelindrea's Forest and the Escape from the Snow Camp, that'd be good reason to re-buy!

 
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