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 Posted:   Jun 4, 2006 - 3:59 PM   
 By:   Michael_McMahan   (Member)

Greetings all,

I was just listening to the JOS cd release and marveling at this wonderous music. I had the pleasure of hearing this performed live a couple of weeks ago, and I'd love to hear yet another take on the music. Anyone have any information on the original vinyl release? Were they the original tracks? Is there any dialog? Any info would be much appreciated. Thanks!

-Michael

 
 Posted:   Jun 4, 2006 - 4:20 PM   
 By:   George Komar   (Member)

Greetings all,

I was just listening to the JOS cd release and marveling at this wonderous music. I had the pleasure of hearing this performed live a couple of weeks ago, and I'd love to hear yet another take on the music. Anyone have any information on the original vinyl release? Were they the original tracks? Is there any dialog? Any info would be much appreciated. Thanks!

-Michael


The JOS CD release is an expansion of the recordings found on the original Polydor release, with Scott conducting the London Philharmonic Orchestra and Chorus at C.T.S Studios in London with Richard Lewsey as engineer -- and NOT the Berlin ensemble noted on the CD.

I carefully compared the vinyl recording track by track with the corresponding CD cues through earphones and discovered that the hall noises (shifting music stands, chair noises, etc.) matched exactly. The Overture, which is one of the many tracks added to the CD and which reiterates many of the sections found in the score proper, has the same ambience as those corresponding sections.

I'm convinced that the CD is the ORIGINAL 1972 soundtrack recording, and NOT a subsequent re-recording..

 
 
 Posted:   Jun 4, 2006 - 4:23 PM   
 By:   shadowman   (Member)

I have a Japanese re-issue of the original album,which seems to be the same
format as the original. It is on the Polydor Japan label, so I suspect that the original is on Polydor also. It has a gatefold jacket in full color. The album runs 39:31 with 15 tracks and no
dialogue. It says original soundtrack
album on the front cover,so I will assume that they are the original tracks. I cannot tell the difference between the LP
and the cd as far as sound or tempo of the recording; they sound pretty much the same except that the cd is longer of course. Sorry I cannot provide a photo.

 
 Posted:   Jun 4, 2006 - 4:26 PM   
 By:   George Komar   (Member)

Sorry I cannot provide a photo.



The image on the CD above is the greater part of the back cover of the gatefold LP. The painting wraps around the entire outer LP cover; the front cover continues with a reclining bare-chested Antony (Charlton Heston - my copy is autographed "Chuck" Heston over his white lower tunic) and Cleopatra (Hildegard Neil) behind him holding a pearl necklace that seems to be wrapped (symbollically?) around his neck.

Here are the LP track titles:
1. Main Titles (Love Theme) (03:39)
2. Give Me to Drink Mandragora (Cleopatra's Theme) (01:59)
3. Confrontation with Pompey (01:27)
4. Antony and Octavia (Caesar's Sister) (01:49)
5. The Barge She Sat In (04:16)
6. One Will Tear the Other (01:00)
7. The Battle of Actium (05:11)
8. Prelude to Part 2 (Love Theme) (01:31)
9. Whither Hast Thou Led Me Egypt (02:24)
10. Death of Enobarbus (02:04)
11. He Goes Forth Gallantly (03:46)
12. Sometimes We See a Cloud That's Dragonish (02:40)
13. Death of Antony (Love Theme) (03:54)
14. Pretty Worm of Nilus (01:46)
15. She Shall Be Buried by Her Antony (End Titles) (02:05)

 
 Posted:   Jun 4, 2006 - 4:54 PM   
 By:   Michael_McMahan   (Member)

Thanks so much guys! I'm glad to hear this isn't yet another record that I have to seak out and transfer. Best regards -

 
 
 Posted:   Jun 4, 2006 - 5:15 PM   
 By:   John B. Archibald   (Member)

Too bad the movie compares so badly with the score. Has anyone else here ever actually seen it? I rented it at one point, just to see if there was more music in the actual film. I barely noticed. The film is so dull, it should be used in anaesthesiology. Neil is wooden, and what's going on with Heston? This was during the period in his career when he somehow managed to appear nearly naked in practically everything he did.

Interestingly, casting him may have been far closer to the actual Antony, who was a rather stolid hunk, but not with too much imagination or skill at statecraft. Great soldier, but easily diverted. In that manner, Heston looked perfect; it's when he starts to spout Shakespeare's lovely poetry that he becomes more or less a walking anachronism.

I even managed to get hold of a copy of the original souvenir program, from e-bay. Can't imagine how the movie rated a program in its original release. I was living in New York at the time, and don't remember it ever playing there. If it did, I doubt the run was longer than a week.

But the music remains a must-have for anyone seriously interested in film scores. Beautiful score.

 
 Posted:   Jun 4, 2006 - 6:54 PM   
 By:   Damian   (Member)

I don't have much to add except I also love this score.One of Scotty's best.
It's fascinating that it could be OST.

 
 Posted:   Jun 4, 2006 - 6:57 PM   
 By:   George Komar   (Member)

Too bad the movie compares so badly with the score. Has anyone else here ever actually seen it?


I rented it as well. Strictly low-budget with the naval battle lifted from BEN-HUR. Still apparently it was a pet project for Heston.

 
 
 Posted:   Jun 4, 2006 - 8:39 PM   
 By:   joec   (Member)


I even managed to get hold of a copy of the original souvenir program, from e-bay. Can't imagine how the movie rated a program in its original release. I was living in New York at the time, and don't remember it ever playing there. If it did, I doubt the run was longer than a week.




I am sure the souvenir program you is the same as mine which was printed in UK for the British release. ANTHONY & CLEOPATRA hardly rated a US release. I don't recall anyone who saw it here.

 
 
 Posted:   Jun 4, 2006 - 10:38 PM   
 By:   The_Mark_of_Score-O   (Member)

I have both souvenir program and LP. There's to be a restored DVD of the film issued shortly, so everyone will have a chance to see and evaluate it for him/herself.

One might surmise, though, that Joe Mankieiwcz secretly underwrote A&C's production costs so that everyone would proclaim his CLEOPATRA to be a work of unalloyed genius by comparison.

 
 
 Posted:   Jun 5, 2006 - 12:40 AM   
 By:   Paul MacLean   (Member)

Too bad the movie compares so badly with the score. Has anyone else here ever actually seen it?

I saw it. I liked it actually. Great dialog for starters!wink

Neal didn't bother me, and I've always admired Heston as an actor.

The rest of the casting draws on some absolutely stellar talent from the English stage -- Julian Glover, John Castle, Eric Porter, Roger Delgado, etc. Their performances are more than enough to hold my interest.

The stock battle footage is a little embarrassing, but John Scott's score really carries the whole production along, as stands alone in its own right. Unquestionably it is one of his best scores.

 
 
 Posted:   Jun 5, 2006 - 7:18 AM   
 By:   musickco   (Member)

The film premiered here in London in Cinerama - probably a good way to see it - rather than the pan and scan video which does not do the production justice.

And yes, made to a budget - but to be appaluded nonetheless - we need to get even more Shakesepeare on film.

Of course the casting of the up and coming stage actress Glenda Jackson as Cleopatra was passed over - a BIG mistake.

 
 
 Posted:   Jun 5, 2006 - 8:03 AM   
 By:   Tall Guy   (Member)

Of course the casting of the up and coming stage actress Glenda Jackson as Cleopatra was passed over - a BIG mistake.


She did her best work on the Morecambe and Wise show.

And, yes, I'm including her political career in that comment.

 
 Posted:   Jun 5, 2006 - 12:33 PM   
 By:   BlanketyBlank   (Member)

John Scott's score realy carries the whole production along, as stands alone in its own right. Unquestionably it is one of his best.

Agreed! As an aside, I must say that the "Egyptian Bacchanal" has to be one of the most infectious, circular tunes I've ever heard. I swear, I once couldn't get the damn thing out of my head for over a week.

 
 Posted:   Jun 5, 2006 - 1:30 PM   
 By:   Damian   (Member)



Agreed! As an aside, I must say that the "Egyptian Bacchanal" has to be one of the most infectious, circular tunes I've ever heard. I swear, I once couldn't get the damn thing out of my head for over a week.


Agreed alsobig grin.I had the first release,without the track,so held off buying again.I finally took the chance and am glad i did.

 
 
 Posted:   Jun 5, 2006 - 1:47 PM   
 By:   Paul MacLean   (Member)

I had the first release,without the track,so held off buying again.I finally took the chance and am glad i did.

Maybe I overestimate my importance, but when I reviewed the original A&C CD for FSM, I expressed a little disappointment that this otherwise stellar release omitted the Bacchanal.

Soon after, John Scott contacted me and said he had forgotten about that cue. Then, a few years later the CD was reissued -- with the Bacchanal!

So you can thank me!big grin

 
 Posted:   Jun 5, 2006 - 1:57 PM   
 By:   Michael_McMahan   (Member)

Thanks Paul! ;o)

Seriously, that is one infectious piece of music. When I heard Scott conducting this at UCLA, I had a giddy smile plastered on my face. For the life of me, I couldn't put those pearly whites away.

NP. Heathers (David Newman)

 
 Posted:   Jun 6, 2006 - 11:40 AM   
 By:   WILLIAMDMCCRUM   (Member)

Actually, Heston's a good stage actor, but here he seems to have gone a bit self-indulgent. A good director could've taken some of that strange head-wagging swagger out of him. He doesn't do that in Ben-Hur or War Lord, or Khartoum or even Ten C because I presume good directors won't let him! He DOES do it in Ant & Cleo, 55 Days, Agony & Ecstasy and even in one scene in 'El Cid': the bit where he delivers the line 'I thought this would be the shortest road to my bride.' He frowns, sticks out the jaw, and wiggles his head from side to side, like he's winding up his skull for a head-butt! Every movie. Ruins everything.

I've got it on a VHS. Neither good nor bad, but nice-looking footage. Naval battles nicked not just from B-H but also 'Cleopatra'. Apparently Peter Snell claimed that the movie costume design was based on a sort of cross between that in Cleo and Ben, so that they could splice footage to save cash.

Someone told me that Scott claimed that he was re-recording bits and pieces from the score at the end of other sessions on other albums he was recording, and then would assemble these to get the whole CD produced on the cheap. This doesn't sound at all feasible to me, amd must be apocryphal. George says it isn't Berlin either, so one wonders what contractual labyrinths have to be negotiated to get these things to us.

 
 Posted:   Jun 6, 2006 - 12:27 PM   
 By:   Damian   (Member)



Maybe I overestimate my importance, but when I reviewed the original A&C CD for FSM, I expressed a little disappointment that this otherwise stellar release omitted the Bachnalle.

Soon after, John Scott contacted me and said he had forgotten about that cue. Then, a few years later the CD was reissued -- with the Bachnalle!

So you can thank me!big grin


Paul


Twice thanks big grin

 
 
 Posted:   Jun 6, 2006 - 12:30 PM   
 By:   MICHAEL HOMA   (Member)

Actually, Heston's a good stage actor, but here he seems to have gone a bit self-indulgent. A good director could've taken some of that strange head-wagging swagger out of him. He doesn't do that in Ben-Hur or War Lord, or Khartoum or even Ten C because I presume good directors won't let him! He DOES do it in Ant & Cleo, 55 Days, Agony & Ecstasy and even in one scene in 'El Cid': the bit where he delivers the line 'I thought this would be the shortest road to my bride.' He frowns, sticks out the jaw, and wiggles his head from side to side, like he's winding up his skull for a head-butt! Every movie. Ruins everything...........well here he was directing himself , so......

I've got it on a VHS. Neither good nor bad, but nice-looking footage. Naval battles nicked not just from B-H but also 'Cleopatra'. Apparently Peter Snell claimed that the movie costume design was based on a sort of cross between that in Cleo and Ben, so that they could splice footage to save cash.

Someone told me that Scott claimed that he was re-recording bits and pieces from the score at the end of other sessions on other albums he was recording, and then would assemble these to get the whole CD produced on the cheap. This doesn't sound at all feasible to me, amd must be apocryphal. George says it isn't Berlin either, so one wonders what contractual labyrinths have to be negotiated to get these things to us.

 
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