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Posted: |
Oct 17, 2016 - 10:06 PM
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By: |
Solium
(Member)
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Well, here in the U.S. the economy started to tank about a year before the current President came in, and then cratered for the last eight years to where one third of the people aren't working, the Labor Force Participation Rate was at it's lowest point in thirty-eight years as of September of last year, a big amount lost everything they had in savings, even more have no savings at all currently (a news report today says sixty-six million Americans, though I've not read it yet), so forth and so on. The money just isn't there for the majority of Americans as it was years ago. Then on top of that we have like twenty limited edition labels now, so it is saturated to a degree for some percentage (I couldn't even guess) of buyers. And that's just a taste. So correct me if wrong, but most orders to these labels come from prodominently North American and countries in Europe, and when both areas are suffering financially, sales aren't going to be what they used to be where every batch of something you had sell outs in a day or less. And they won't get better for some time. I'm not sure all the labels will survive a prolonged bad market like that.
Believe me, I'd love to have hundreds of dollars or more each year, but it's not not remotely possible, for me and a majority of people in my country.
That's the long answer to my short answer.  
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Posted: |
Oct 18, 2016 - 7:54 AM
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By: |
ryanpaquet
(Member)
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Out of interest why don’t you follow the example of the actual industry you’re linked to?
Each film company markets their release months or in odd cases years in advance to allow the public to know what is coming.
Literally today “Varese have a club release on the 24th” So clearly you know what it is, so why not announce it?
Gives the buyer time to plan if they want it or not & adjust their spending accordingly & maybe if they have an old copy off load it to those who do not follow releases.
All these labels seem to play the “guess game” but as someone who spent years in marketing films & its gotten worse as the years have rolled on, playing guessing games with the public does not work. If you want more “sell outs” then inform your market place with enough notice to allow them to adjust & be ready.
Clearly income plays a huge part & it did in the days I worked in the film industry, from the VHS (and beta) boom there has been the “I’ll wait for the tape as I don’t want to pay for a cinema show” attitude, but then there are those planning their “opening night” attendance. Playing guessing gives give the buyer the chance to forget or get bored or just don’t care & so another release passes by.
I know that some labels say they get bogged down with “where is it” or “why can’t I order it now” type email/communication, simple ignore them, they arrive when they arrive, and at least your market knows it’s going to happen.
Once your deals are done almost like a locked down print or “green light production” your product is secure & you can market the hell out of it so your potential buyer knows.
Guessing games I think & from experience just never really works.
I also agree with many here, post (not the labels fault), lack of income, customs (not the labels fault) & maybe a reducing market do not help. But it would be interesting for a label to say “here is what is happening, here are the potential release dates” the label can then judge how quick it sells??
A live example The Rolling Stones new studio album comes out in December, it can be pre-ordered since the 11 October, and plenty of advance notice to sort your income out & maybe get it or know it’s about.
The market is a niche with it seems a declining audience who have many other choices, buy the cd or buy the film or what have you?
Film companies & nearly all companies have moved with the times, “get it out there to bring awareness” maybe the labels need to do the same?
Old or new enjoy the music (if you buy it)
Andy b
Andy really nails it here. Especially for us international buyers, with shipping and customs charges increasing - we can get a little upset just after placing an order, to find out that the next month there's something else released we would have jumped on.
Intrada let it slip that they were working on Ten Commandments and I think folks were prepared for that one once it dropped.
In the USA it is much easier to order on a monthly basis with the USPS rates being very competitive. Especially if you're just after one or two releases a month.
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Posted: |
Oct 18, 2016 - 9:56 AM
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By: |
Dana Wilcox
(Member)
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I am 68 years old and started collecting soundtracks when I was 12, in the era of Alfred Newman, Dimitri Tiomkin, Franz Waxman etc., and soon thereafter, the salad days of Elmer Bernstein, Alex North and others. I played the grooves off of my copy of LILIES OF THE FIELD, by some new guy named Jerry Goldsmith. Primarily I loved the 60s and 70s scores, but began to lose interest as the 80s and 90s composers turned increasingly to synth and "soundscape" and rock scores. When CDs came along, in the late 80s, I was thrilled to be able to get my favorite film scores on "permanent" media, at least to put behind me the snaps and pops that seemed to grow on my favorite LPs even when I didn't play them often. First on the agenda of course was to lay hands on the film scores that I most loved, and second, to explore the newer works of composers I liked, as well as those "newly-discovered" (by me) composers who were working primarily in the orchestral mode.
Thanks to the incredible efforts of FSM, Intrada, SAE, Varese Sarabande and such later-arriving players as Kritzerland and La-La Land, I have been able both to re-build my early collection and expand my appreciation of more recent film music, in releases that vastly surpass the completeness and sound quality of anything I ever owned on LP.
Every "grail" of mine has been released by one and/or another of these companies, except for one: the complete original tracks from TO KILL A MOCKINGBIRD, which I know is out there but which has reportedly hit clearance snags that have stalled the project. That is not to say that I will never buy anything else, as I have continued to buy soundtracks that sound interesting as they come along -- orchestral things I "never knew I wanted" until they appeared. I am also a sucker for expanded and re-mastered versions of my core group of favorite Golden and Silver era classic scores -- no idea how many different releases of THE ROBE and THE EGYPTIAN I've bought, for example. Happily enjoying the new TEN COMMANDMENTS as I write. Original track releases of scores that had only received re-recorded releases (e.g., the early to middle 60s Mancini scores, finally made available by Intrada) will almost always get my money also. The largest virtually untapped area for me is television scores from (especially) the 60s and 70s, the Goldenberg tv movies and series scores for example, such as we've seen from the DR. KILDARE and MISSION IMPOSSIBLE box sets. I don't know, maybe not enough people care about those to make it worthwhile. Not much interest on my part in the bombastic sci fi and CGI "comic book" blockbuster scores.
There is obviously a diversity of interests among the collectors, both in style and era, so I can't answer this fundamental question for anyone else. I think there has been a diversity to the releases that mirrors the diversity of interests in out niche group, but as we parse down that diversity, perhaps there are not enough of any one of them to sustain even a cottage industry like film music. Time will tell. I hope all of these companies go on forever, and I will continue to try my best to support them with my purchases.
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Thank goodness I don't know what a Giacchino, Zimmer, Tyler is.
Brian Tyler and Michael Giacchino do NOT belong in the same category as Hans Zimmer.
I know. Zimmer is far better.
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We few, we happy few, we band of collectors,
we lived through a Golden Age of soundtrack releases.
And he today that spends his dimes with me on film scores,
Shall be my brother, no matter the size
Nor the focus of his collection.
Fact is, these past twenty years have, specialty labals have released vintage soundtracks of the Golden and Silver Age in unprecedented proportions. Classic Goldsmith scores as Logan's Run or The Flim-Flam Man? Released. Bernard Herrman's scores for OBSESSION? Released. Rózsa's music for Ben Hur? Released. North's Dragonslayer? Released.
I still buy music, I still buy CDs. Just these past two weeks I bought more than half a dozen CDs --- but only one or so was a soundrack (The Hateful Eight) ).
I don't have to buy as many specialty soundtrack releases nowadays I already own most of the stuff I once desired.
The specialty soundtrack market has always been a market that mined the unreleased quality stuff of glorious film scores of the past... and while there may still be a few lost grails (Damnation Alley, in my case, for example) and while there may still be lots of film scores unreleased that are of interest to some, most of the best of the best has been released.
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Posted: |
Oct 19, 2016 - 7:44 AM
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By: |
Rollin Hand
(Member)
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1. Where are the people who used to buy lots of soundtracks?
2. When 1000 copies of almost anything sold out within a few days, seems for the most part are gone except for a few few exceptions.
3. Are people busy with other hobbies?
4. Do they not collect or listen to film music as much anymore?
5. Are some of the film music fans passing away? Something is up.
6. Is there too many releases right now, by too many labels?
7. Every other month one of the labels has an awesome box set of goodies.
8. Is the constant increase of shipping by the USPS to foreign customers stopping them from buying much these days?
9. Titles that should be LONG sold out are still available, examples can be found at pretty much all the labels.
10. I'm curious, what are you spending habits now a days?
11. Are you more picky?
12. Too much out there now?
Since the demise of FSM, my interest for soundtracks weakened.
FSM was the label that really used to catch my passion back in 1996.
Besides, the time of the 60’s/70’s releases and Jerry Fielding releases are over.
There are not enough engrossing titles—according to my vintage taste—and the majority of my favorite composers are “not” or “under” represented.
The market is different from the previous decade so I tend to just don’t care anymore. The current taste is not my bag.
There are not enough premiere releases and too many re-releases.
The reason why I don't care anymore is that the market is not interested in that kind of music I deeply wish—not enough buyers:
Amram, David The Young Savages (original) © 1961 UA
Amram, David Seven Days In May (rejected score) © 1963 P
Barry, John Walkabout (original) © 1971 F
Barry, John The Day of the Locust (original) © 1975 U
Barton, Dee Play Misty for Me © 1971 U
Barton, Dee Thunderbolt and Lightfoot © 1974 UA
Colombier, Michel Colossus, The Forbin Project © 1970 U
Compinsky, Alec Private Property © 1960
DeVol, Frank Kiss Me Deadly © 1955 MGM
DeVol, Frank Attack © 1956 UA
Duning, George Nightfall © 1957 C
Fielding, Jerry Johnny Got His Gun © 1971
Fielding, Jerry Junior Bonner © 1972 MGM
Fielding, Jerry The Outfit (complete) © 1973 MGM
Fielding, Jerry The Outlaw Josey Wales © 1976 WB
Fielding, Jerry The Gauntlet (complete) © 1977 WB
Fried, Gerald The Killing © 1956 MGM
Frontiere, Dominic The Marriage-Go-Round © 1961 Fox
Frontiere, Dominic Hero's Island © 1962 UA
Goldsmith, Jerry Hour of the Gun (original) © 1967 UA
Goldsmith, Jerry The Chairman (original) © 1969 F
Goldsmith, Jerry The Last Run (original) © 1971 MGM
Goldsmith, Jerry The Other © 1972 F
Goldsmith, Jerry Shamus © 1973 C
Goldsmith, Jerry The Reincarnation of Peter Proud © 1975
Goldsmith, Jerry Damnation Alley © 1977 F
Grusin, Dave Willie Boy © 1969 U
Grusin, Dave Fuzz © 1972 MGM
Grusin, Dave The Nickel Ride © 1974 F
Herrmann, Bernard Citizen Kane © 1941
Herrmann, Bernard The Magnificent Ambersons © 1942
Herrmann, Bernard The Man Who Knew Too Much © 1956
Herrmann, Bernard Psycho © 1960
Herrmann, Bernard Cape Fear © 1962
Herrmann, Bernard Jason and the Argonauts (original) © 1963
Herrmann, Bernard Marnie (original) © 1964
Herrmann, Bernard Farenheit 451 (original) © 1966
Herrmann, Bernard Companions in Nightmare © 1968 U
Herrmann, Bernard Twisted Nerve © 1968
Herrmann, Bernard Endless Night © 1972 MGM
Jones, Quincy Mirage © 1965 U
Jones, Quincy In Cold Blood © 1967 C
Jones, Quincy The Anderson Tapes © 1971 C
Jones, Quincy The Hot Rock © 1972 F
Jones, Quincy The New Centurions © 1972 C
Jones, Quincy The Getaway © 1972 WB
Mancini, Henry Experiment in Terror (original) © 1962 C
Mancini, Henry A Shot in the Dark (original) © 1964 MGM
Mancini, Henry Arabesque (original) © 1966 U
Mandel, Johnny Harper © 1966 WB
Mellé, Gil The Ultimate Warrior © 1975 WB
Mellé, Gil Embryo © 1976
Mellé, Gil Starship Invasions © 1977 WB
Murray, Lyn The Prowler © 1951
Rosenman, Leonard Race with the Devil © 1975 F
Rosenman, Leonard Countdown © 1968 WB
Rosenman, Leonard The Rise and Fall of Legs Diamond © 1960 WB
Rosenman, Leonard Pork Chop Hill © 1959 MGM
Rosenman, Leonard The Young Stranger © 1957 U
Rosenman, Leonard Rebel Without a Cause © 1955 WB
Rosenman, Leonard East of Eden © 1955 WB
Schickele, Peter Silent Running © 1972 U
Schifrin, Lalo Hell in the Pacific © 1968 MGM
Schifrin, Lalo Eye of the Cat © 1969 U
Schifrin, Lalo The Beguiled © 1971 U
Schifrin, Lalo The Neptune Factor © 1973
Schifrin, Lalo Charley Varrick © 1973 U
Schifrin, Lalo St. Ives © 1976 WB
Small, Michael The Stepford Wives © 1975 C
Small, Michael Night Moves © 1975 WB
Small, Michael The Drowning Pool (Harper) © 1975 WB
Waxman, Franz Rear Window © 1954 P/U
Waxman, Franz He Ran All The Way © 1951 UA
Williams, John The Sugarland Express © 1974 U
Williams, John The Towering Inferno © 1974 F
Williams, John The Eiger Sanction © 1975 U
Williams, John Superman © 1978 WB
Williams, John Dracula © 1979 U
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I still enjoy buying CDs but have cut down on the number of purchases in the past few years. For one, as someone in a previous post mentioned, I have a lot of discs I've never even gotten around to listening to. Now I try to concentrate on releases that I'm sure I can devote time to. Also, the U.S. economy is still stagnant (in spite of what some in the news media claim). The cost of
everything keeps going up and up but wages are not keeping pace. I don't have the disposable income I had in the past.
The CD is still my preferred way of listening to music, soundtrack or otherwise. But I know we have seen the signs that the format is fading. I went into my local Best Buy last week and the CD section has been reduced by 75%! It was a tiny little rack instead of the double-sided isle it was not long ago.
I am still collecting and will continue to do so as long as compact discs last. There are still a few grails out there that I would love to have in my collection!
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Posted: |
Oct 20, 2016 - 10:20 AM
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By: |
Alex Klein
(Member)
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I fully support the notion of announcing the actual CD titles in advance of their release. I cannot count the soundtracks i've missed out on because of the long guessing games and surprise releases most specialist labels subject us to on a continuous basis.
Apart from this issue, I must also agree with all those who are generally disappointed with the current state of films and film music. Believe me, i've tried to digest Desplat, Giacchino and the like but, despite a few of their scores, they simply don't impress me. We could debate forever if their mediocre scores are the result of the god-awful demands of the industry, but whatever is the cause, I cannot listen to them as I listen to Barry, Morricone, Goldsmith and Williams. Goodness, to think there was actually a time in which these names shared the spotlight and wrote music day in and day out. It's becoming surreal.
Alex
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I've got another theory for the decline in sales---and pardon me if I missed it earlier in the thread. Over the past 20 years, labels have released and sold a lot of what I call "Consolation Scores." Scores by popular composers who had bigger hits---but those hits were unavailable.
20 years ago everyone had dozens of grails which included well-known or unexpanded scores. I really wanted Silvestri's Predator, but bought Ricochet and Judgement Night as "consolations." I would have preferred an expanded Conan the Barbarian but settled for Flesh and Blood. I was dying for Rosenman's Fantastic Voyage and Beneath the Planet of the Apes but bought Keeper of the City and Robocop 2 looking for similar thrills. I wanted Lost Weekend but settled for The Private Files of J. Edgar Hoover. And so on.
And then the boutique labels were born and we got all we ever wanted --- and more, beyond our wildest imaginations. Have you ever bought a consolation score? Are there CDs in your collection that seem to matter less because you now have the "better" versions of the composer's work?
Maybe if we're buying less now, its because FSM, Intrada, La-La Land, Varese, et al have done their job too well!
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