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 Posted:   Aug 29, 2015 - 8:55 PM   
 By:   Zooba   (Member)

Why did Goldsmith think that the movie JEREMIAH JOHNSON sucked?

Anyone hear that interview where Goldsmith was talking about how he was on a International flight and director Sydney Pollack just happened to be on the same flight?

Anyway it's a pre- MASADA story and this was back around the time of JEREMIAH JOHNSON which was directed by Syd Pollack. MASADA the Mini-Series had not been made at that point, and at that time Sydney Pollack was in the process of producing and directing I believe, the project. It was a project that Goldsmith definitely wanted to score totally interested in the Jewish subject matter and story, but he was apprehensive about approaching Pollack to discuss his interest. Anyway Goldsmith said that the flight just happened to be showing Pollack's film JEREMIAH JOHNSON which he said he "hated." He might have even said he thought it was dreadful.

So I'm wondering, was it just a matter of personal taste? I always thought JEREMIAH JOHNSON was kind of cool.

Any thoughts? What do you think of JEREMIAH JOHNSO? I had the old LP Soundtrack and really liked the John Rubinstein score.

We all know what happened years later with MASADA, which ultimately had no Pollack involvement at all.

 
 Posted:   Aug 30, 2015 - 1:47 AM   
 By:   CindyLover   (Member)

was it just a matter of personal taste?

Yes.

 
 
 Posted:   Aug 30, 2015 - 3:03 AM   
 By:   Hurdy Gurdy   (Member)

Well, although it's all down to personal opinion, I think Goldsmith's taste in films generally stunk.
He picked some absolute whoppers to score down the years. Far too many for it to be considered
bad luck.
If he did think JJ was dreadful, it just goes to show he couldn't recognise a good film if it slapped
him in the face.

 
 
 Posted:   Aug 30, 2015 - 3:03 AM   
 By:   Hurdy Gurdy   (Member)

Dp

 
 Posted:   Aug 30, 2015 - 3:27 AM   
 By:   Grecchus   (Member)

JJ is a film more people should see so that a few can come away with a sense of appreciation. It's about the vertical, not the horizontal. These days everything is horizontal. People are born and bred into it. But there's something to be said for the vertical. It should never be forgotten.

 
 
 Posted:   Aug 30, 2015 - 3:38 AM   
 By:   Rollin Hand   (Member)

JJ is a film more people should see so that a few can come away with a sense of appreciation. It's about the vertical, not the horizontal. These days everything is horizontal. People are born and bred into it. But there's something to be said for the vertical. It should never be forgotten.


JJ is about the Indian mystics. It's a pagan film.

 
 Posted:   Aug 30, 2015 - 4:03 AM   
 By:   Grecchus   (Member)

It's about the harshest form of living there is - one in which total self-sufficiency has to be embraced with ultimate competence. The conviction of self-belief has to be wired in without any gaps in the logic. It's as hard and as simple as that.

Why would JG not like the picture? It didn't follow a stereotype. Johnson has nothing but walls to climb throughout and it doesn't get any easier.

And at the end of the story what are we faced with? There's a well known saying which sums up JJ, but I'm not going to cheapen things by wringing it out here. smile

 
 
 Posted:   Aug 30, 2015 - 4:31 AM   
 By:   BROMHEAD1   (Member)

Jeremiah Johnson is a very good movie.I first watched it on Blu-ray a couple of years ago.Great disc.Then watched it again a couple a few months ago and bought the score which i really like.

 
 
 Posted:   Aug 30, 2015 - 8:50 AM   
 By:   MCurry29   (Member)

Who knows? Who cares? What does he know about films? He's a film composer and I could care less what he thinks about a movie. We all have our opinions. Like Ballad of Cable Hogue is the worst piece of tripe I have ever heard, but what do I know? I'm just a music loving freak.
Jeremiah Johnson is an awesome movie-that just my opinion.

 
 
 Posted:   Aug 30, 2015 - 8:58 AM   
 By:   Last Child   (Member)

maybe he was pissed the title wasnt Jeremiah Goldsmith.

 
 
 Posted:   Aug 30, 2015 - 12:15 PM   
 By:   couvee   (Member)

Jeremiah Johnson made a big impression on me when I saw it in the theatre as a teenager. I bought the LP soundtrack and was fond of that. I now have the FSM CD that is an improvement over the old LP program and I have the film on DVD and still love it. Just reading this post gets me in the mood to see it again. Great film. Different take then most other westerns. But hey, it was the 70-s and I grew up in that era. The youngsters in this house probably hate it.

 
 Posted:   Aug 30, 2015 - 1:06 PM   
 By:   Grecchus   (Member)

Due to this thread's prominence I did some reading of the FSM volume entry for JJ. The name John Rubinstein came up and described him as an actor/composer. Then, when I later watched some TV at my host's address, an old Spielberg TV movie, Something Evil, just happened to be starting. As the credits rolled the name of John Rubinstein appeared. Could this be the same Rubinstein involved with Jeremiah Johnson? Having watched the TV movie I thought I'd check with IMDB and sure enough, it's the same guy. In fact, I didn't know his name but I knew his face, which appeared many times on TV over my childhood but remained nameless - until now.

If you didn't already know of him, here he is. In Something Evil, he appears at Sandy Dennis' door, all the while making oblique references to his uncle, a neighbor of Dennis in the movie and played by Ralph Bellamy. I'd seen this movie before a long time ago. It's just a little weird I only made the connection today, as the crow flies.

http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0748270/?ref_=tt_cl_t6

 
 
 Posted:   Aug 30, 2015 - 1:14 PM   
 By:   Zooba   (Member)

Yes Grecchus, John Rubinstein Actor and Composer are one and the same.

Rubinstein also appeared in THE BOYS FROM BRAZIL as a Jewish Sympathizer with Laurence Olivier's character working against the Nazis.

I first became aware of Rubinstein when he was the Original PIPPIN on Broadway with Jill Clayburgh and on the TV Drama FAMILY back in the mid 70's. He also composed a great Main Title Theme for that series which was used for several seasons. Directed Ed Zwick was a story editor on that show as well in his early days.

John is also the son of Classical Composer Arthur Rubinstein.

 
 Posted:   Aug 30, 2015 - 1:41 PM   
 By:   Sigerson Holmes   (Member)

No wonder the film composer Arthur B. Rubinstein (FSM's "Whose Life Is It Anyway?") uses the B.!

 
 Posted:   Aug 30, 2015 - 1:52 PM   
 By:   Sigerson Holmes   (Member)

Well, although it's all down to personal opinion, I think Goldsmith's taste in films generally stunk.
He picked some absolute whoppers to score down the years. Far too many for it to be considered
bad luck.


I don't think it was luck either, but it could have been a number of things, chief among them, "What's left after John Williams has had his pick?" A composer's gotta eat, too, so I think it's safe to assume there were some job offers over the years that were up to Goldsmith's price tag, if not necessarily worthy of his talents.

Wasn't Goldsmith one of the "go-to guys" for a last-minute replacement score in his day?

I prefer to believe that the number of misfires he wound up scoring are more of a tribute to his adventurousness in selecting projects, and there's the occasional opportunity for a great score to "rescue" an "almost-good" movie, too.

 
 
 Posted:   Aug 30, 2015 - 3:37 PM   
 By:   chromaparadise   (Member)

Much of this “Goldsmith scored a lot of stinkers” is purely a view made in hindsight, and is a matter of personal taste—just as Goldsmith's view of “Jeremiah Johnson” was. “The Omen” was considered by many as a film trying to capitalize on the popularity of “The Exorcist.” It very easily could have failed at the box office and fallen into the hindsight “stinker” category.

I must say, this concept bandied about that Goldsmith was following around picking up Williams' table scraps is utter nonsense. John Williams (whom I enjoy and respect) scored his fair share of “stinkers” in his day; but somehow, he always seems to get a pass on that. I wonder why that is? Hmmmmmm...

No filmmaker sets out to make a bad movie, lots of things can happen to derail a great concept for a film (too many here to list). It's important to remember that Williams got involved with “Star Wars” as a favor to Spielberg. Just about everybody involved (except Williams, to his credit) thought “Star Wars” would turn out to be a “stinker.” And Lucas himself made the comment about “Star Wars”: “It just has to do with people happening to like dumb movies.” (pg. 183 of "Skywalking: The Life and Films of George Lucas")

As consummate professionals, both Goldsmith and Williams wrote superlative scores for films that wound up on both ends of the quality and popularity scales. Not everything is an instant classic or appeals to everyone's tastes.

 
 Posted:   Aug 30, 2015 - 6:51 PM   
 By:   Sigerson Holmes   (Member)

There's something to be said for Lucas' and (others') "dumb movies," though, and that is that they often present a composer a terrific "palette" upon which to create. Even James Horner was given the extraordinarily silly "Krull" to score and the result is, IMHO, one of his masterpeices. The "Omen" series gave Goldsmith, not only his only Oscar win, but also a SW trilogy-sized-chance to flex his muscles and create a multi-film "magnum opus" of sorts. The hindsight question of whether a film was a "stinker" is often determined by box-office performance.

 
 
 Posted:   Aug 30, 2015 - 7:09 PM   
 By:   Bob Bryden   (Member)

Double post.

 
 
 Posted:   Aug 30, 2015 - 7:09 PM   
 By:   Bob Bryden   (Member)

'Jeremiah Johnson' looms very large in my legend. I wrote a song inspired by a line in it, 'Feels Like Far' which is on my 'Polaroid Verite' album. www.bobbbryden.com and available on iTunes.

 
 
 Posted:   Aug 30, 2015 - 7:30 PM   
 By:   chriscoyle   (Member)

Yes Grecchus, John Rubinstein Actor and Composer are one and the same.

Rubinstein also appeared in THE BOYS FROM BRAZIL as a Jewish Sympathizer with Laurence Olivier's character working against the Nazis.

I first became aware of Rubinstein when he was the Original PIPPIN on Broadway with Jill Clayburgh and on the TV Drama FAMILY back in the mid 70's. He also composed a great Main Title Theme for that series which was used for several seasons. Directed Ed Zwick was a story editor on that show as well in his early days.

John is also the son of Classical Composer Arthur Rubinstein.

[/

I use to go to Broadway back in the day just out of high school. We had seen a play and the friends I was with had seen Pippin previously and we hung out at the backstage door after the play to get autographs. We all wanted Irene Ryan's and of course Ben Vereen's. John Rubenstein came out and there was an awkward pause. No one really was waiting for his autograph. We just said hi and he walked by. Those were the days. Got Patrick Macnee's too after Sleuth. Now that's a gentleman to meet in person back in the 70's.

 
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