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 Posted:   Dec 13, 2013 - 3:30 PM   
 By:   Yavar Moradi   (Member)

I'm guessing those 2 CD sets were ones he made himself with sound effects and dialogue? I'm so excited to get this new recording, but I'll buy the whole score over again if tapes of the original recording are ever found!

I've gone ahead and updated my first post in this thread, to remove QBVII from my wishlist. It was my #1 choice (everything else will move up now, and I'm in the process of deciding what to add in the #10 place). I'd written, "QB VII -- there's so much in this epic score, endless inventive variations on the themes you know from the short LP." Now everyone will find out just how much more great music Goldsmith wrote!

I also went ahead and removed The Other from my list since apparently the original tracks survive, included as an isolated score track on a Twilight Time Blu-ray. I only hope Varese puts out a Deluxe Edition as they own the rights in perpetuity even though they just released a 22 minute suite as 1 track (paired with a fuller release of Mephisto Waltz). I guess I still would buy a new complete re-recording in modern sound of that lovely score, though!

Yavar

 
 
 Posted:   Dec 13, 2013 - 3:57 PM   
 By:   Mr. Shark   (Member)

A couple of posts have mentioned UNDER FIRE and LEGEND and I totally agree! I'd very much like to have two of Jerry's masterpieces in completely orchestral versions - they would really soar!

But the synths were part of Goldmsith's conceptions of those scores; do you get rid of them just because you don't like them, or they sound dated? What if someone decided they didn't like the pan pipes in UNDER FIRE because it made them think of late-night TV ads for Zamfir? Would you be o.k. with that being changed? I don't think we should be arbitrarily changing scores just to meet our 2012 tastes.


FYI, the pan flutes in UNDER FIRE are synths - a Yamaha DX1 (patch #23) and a Yamaha GS1 (#8 - with the indication 'Touch Response'). The eerie Inca flute-like sound that opens the Rebel March from 'Nicaragua' is a DX2 patch (#30).

So by culling the synths, you'd be getting rid of utterly classic timbres from these scores. Imagine 'Docking' or 'The Letter' from CAPRICORN ONE without those phasing Arp Solina chords? It would be nowhere near as haunting as the original.

 
 
 Posted:   Dec 14, 2013 - 11:06 AM   
 By:   chromaparadise   (Member)

A couple of posts have mentioned UNDER FIRE and LEGEND and I totally agree! I'd very much like to have two of Jerry's masterpieces in completely orchestral versions - they would really soar!

But the synths were part of Goldmsith's conceptions of those scores; do you get rid of them just because you don't like them, or they sound dated? What if someone decided they didn't like the pan pipes in UNDER FIRE because it made them think of late-night TV ads for Zamfir? Would you be o.k. with that being changed? I don't think we should be arbitrarily changing scores just to meet our 2012 tastes.


FYI, the pan flutes in UNDER FIRE are synths - a Yamaha DX1 (patch #23) and a Yamaha GS1 (#8 - with the indication 'Touch Response'). The eerie Inca flute-like sound that opens the Rebel March from 'Nicaragua' is a DX2 patch (#30).

So by culling the synths, you'd be getting rid of utterly classic timbres from these scores. Imagine 'Docking' or 'The Letter' from CAPRICORN ONE without those phasing Arp Solina chords? It would be nowhere near as haunting as the original.


The pan flutes in UNDER FIRE are NOT synth patches. You're confusing MEDICINE MAN with UNDER FIRE. Listen closely to the two different recordings, there's a distinct difference in realism. The pan flute sounds in MEDICINE MAN are distinctly synth patches... Think logically, if the pan flutes in UNDER FIRE were synth patches, why would Goldsmith then choose to use inferior sounding patches 10 YEARS LATER? Besides...Inside info...Who played the pan flutes in KARATE KID?...Hint...Starts with a Z and ends with a R.

There's also a distant "whistling" lead that Goldsmith uses in many tracks, which IS a synth patch, but that's not the same as the chuffing rhythms of the pan flutes.

 
 
 Posted:   Dec 14, 2013 - 3:11 PM   
 By:   Mr. Shark   (Member)

The pan flutes in UNDER FIRE are NOT synth patches. You're confusing MEDICINE MAN with UNDER FIRE.

Just checked again, you're right. Found this:

"pan pipes (actually commercial PVC piping cut to Goldsmith’s specifications)"

http://www.filmscoremonthly.com/cds/detail.cfm/CDID/398/

The GS1 and DX1 are probably just doubling the pan flutes.


 
 Posted:   Feb 10, 2014 - 3:59 PM   
 By:   Yavar Moradi   (Member)

I'm thinking of revising my entry for #1. Currently it says, "1. Black Patch / Face of a Fugitive -- His first two theatrical scores, both westerns, would make a great doubleheader as I'm pretty sure the original tapes haven't survived."

But I got to thinking...Jerry also has quite a few TV episode scores for which tapes no longer survive. Tadlow shouldn't be against rerecording his lost TV scores; after all they just did QB VII complete!

A decent number of Jerry TV episode scores were for westerns. Our friendly neighborhood Zooba has even posted lovely recorded-off-the-TV excerpts for some of these and put them on Youtube (as he did with a Black Patch suite). What if, instead of squishing Jerry's 1st and 3rd feature scores on a doubleheader, they were each split up into separate releases, neither of them being "filler" for the other (I'm not even positive they would have both fit on one disc and may have necessitated 2 CDs if done as one release).

This way, the discs' running time would be filled out by Jerry's TV western scores, however many comfortably fit, and all of us Jerry nuts get more unreleased gems that wouldn't warrant the attention if done as some sort of release on their own. Each feature score can be a headliner, with the TV scores being fantastic bonuses. What do you fellow fans say to that?

There is also a potential up side for Prometheus who is footing the bill: each disc would still be the typical $19.95 list price to us, but the costs of the recording sessions would decrease because most of the TV episode scores would use only a small orchestra, often between 20 and 30 players at most. Therefore each separate disc would have almost half of it recorded with a much reduced orchestra, and would cost much less than recording a whole disc of feature Goldsmith scoring, where he was able to write for larger ensembles.

Yavar

 
 Posted:   Feb 14, 2014 - 10:59 AM   
 By:   Yavar Moradi   (Member)

For entry number six I had written, "6. The List of Adrian Messenger -- only if Varese doesn't put finally out the original tracks of course."

Clearly this has been recently rectified, so it remains to replace the spot in my wish list, and while poring over Lukas Kendall's reminiscences about each in-print FSM release from a couple years back, I noticed the following comment which I had forgotten about: In the section on The Last Run (a score for which the original recording is apparently lost but at least the album recording is incredibly similar), he said, "I love this era of Goldsmith's 'mod' writing--'Border Crossing' from The Last Run is a prime example. Unfortunately two of the better scores in this style, Shamus and the ABC TV movie Pursuit, are kaput as far as master tapes."

So unless the tapes are miraculously found, I think our only hope for these titles is a Tadlow re-recording for Prometheus Records. They would make a nice pairing and Mr. Fitzpatrick has already produced the only release of any music from Pursuit, in a CoPP re-recording for Silva Screen (included on their four disc Goldsmith set, if anyone's interested). Clearly he doesn't look down on the "mod" style and he's said on multiple occasions that it would not be hard to replicate the sound in a re-recording, as many people has voiced doubts about it. Since he has previously captured the 60s pop feel so well for the pop version of the Hour of the Gun theme, as well as doing accurate synthesizers for The Salamander, I think he could pull these two off wonderfully!

Yavar

P.S. One further thing to note: Mark Ford suggested The Blue Max in this very thread. Apparently it WILL be a future title in this series! James Fitzpatrick just let the cat out of the bag and it was confirmed by the reconstructionist. It's all ready to be recorded and probably would have been soon if not for LLL's announcement of a new 2 disc release of the original tapes, "rebuilt from the ground up by Michael Mattesino and Neil S. Bulk" -- exciting, but it has pushed back the plans to re-record The Blue Max until a couple years from now, for the film's 50th anniversary. I think this is perhaps a happy accident and really look forward to it when it comes out, as well as LLL's upcoming reissue.

 
 Posted:   Oct 30, 2014 - 1:26 PM   
 By:   Yavar Moradi   (Member)

It was looking as if perhaps this wonderful series had stalled, because after three Goldsmith releases in a row James Fitzpartrick had recorded Barry's Mister Moses (and a second Barry score which is unknown but due to be released soon) and announced plans for newly recording complete Herrmann's Obsession (happening in just a few days!), Tiomkin's Duel in the Sun, and Rozsa's Sodom & Gomorrah!

I'd obnoxiously questioned him about whether the Goldsmith series was ended and he hadn't addressed it but in a recent post for the thread about Obsession, he kindly let slip that "a Goldsmith CD" will be done next year along with the Tiomkin and Rozsa scores!
http://filmscoremonthly.com/board/posts.cfm?threadID=106277&forumID=1&archive=0&pageID=3&r=243#bottom

Perhaps there is also a further clue in that he said "a Goldsmith CD" instead of "a Goldsmith score" -- the excitable part of me wants to jump to conclusions and say it's perhaps two shorter scores on a single CD together!

There are lots of good possibilities for that, not least of which is Shamus/Pursuit which I'd mentioned last, but of course my #1 hope is Black Patch with Face of a Fugitive...

Yavar

 
 
 Posted:   Oct 30, 2014 - 1:28 PM   
 By:   captain_avis   (Member)

Was there not some discussion about Goldsmith's The Chairman being in line for a re-recording? Has that one already been recorded or might it be one of the forthcoming titles?

Chris

 
 Posted:   Oct 30, 2014 - 2:08 PM   
 By:   Yavar Moradi   (Member)

It certainly might be The Chairman, which would make me (and Jeff Bond) extremely happy. I just thought because James said "a Goldsmith CD" rather than "a Goldsmith score" was possibly his way of not limiting it to one score (assuming he didn't want to just outright reveal that it was two).

I don't believe the Chairman in complete form would fit on a CD with another complete score (though maybe James is considering a suite to fill out the CD, like he did with The Red Pony to supplement Hour of the Gun). But one Goldsmith score can of course still qualify as "a Goldsmith CD" (except for QB VII, obviously, which needed two) and if it's a single Goldsmith score I certainly hope it's The Chairman.

Yavar

 
 
 Posted:   Oct 30, 2014 - 9:35 PM   
 By:   RM Eastman   (Member)

"THE CHAIRMAN" is a fantastic score, I hope this is the Goldsmith on Tadlow's plate?

 
 
 Posted:   Oct 30, 2014 - 10:23 PM   
 By:   captain_avis   (Member)

Well I do remember that Mr. Fitzpatrick had mentioned being very close to re-recording the Blue Max just before LLL re-released it, so I guess that's another potential candidate. I'd personally prefer the Chairman though.

Chris

 
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