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Posted: |
Aug 11, 2011 - 9:03 AM
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By: |
RoryR
(Member)
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The Burton movie was an artistic disaster, a debacle of unmitigated proportions that really damaged the brand name. I don't entirely blame it on Burton, though, he was just "doing it for the money." I blame the studio that had the project in development for nearly a decade and in the end, in the words of James Cameron, took the most egregious approach possible.
It just plain stinks. I don't like anything about it. It was a rushed production because there was a fear of a strike at the time, and everything shows that. Rick Baker did the best he could, but he wasn't happy with the script and Burton forced him to do the awful female chimp designs. The production design makes the entire movie look like bad Kabuki theatre, and Elfman's score is spread over it all like so much corn syrup.
Burton doesn't talk about the movie, and nearly everyone involved now acknowledges it was a misfire -- to say the least.
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Posted: |
Aug 11, 2011 - 9:22 AM
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By: |
MikeP2
(Member)
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The Burton movie was an artistic disaster, a debacle of unmitigated proportions that really damaged the brand name. I don't entirely blame it on Burton, though, he was just "doing it for the money." I blame the studio that had the project in development for nearly a decade and in the end, in the words of James Cameron, took the most egregious approach possible.
It just plain stinks. I don't like anything about it. It was a rushed production because there was a fear of a strike at the time, and everything shows that. Rick Baker did the best he could, but he wasn't happy with the script and Burton forced him to do the awful female chimp designs. The production design makes the entire movie look like bad Kabuki theatre, and Elfman's score is spread over it all like so much corn syrup.
Burton doesn't talk about the movie, and nearly everyone involved now acknowledges it was a misfire -- to say the least.
The Burton movie was a tremendous train wreck, just truly wretched. It was one of those films you watch and feel embarrassed for everyone involved. It was SyFy channel bad. The only saving grace was Tim Roth who gave it his all. He was wonderful but gave a menacing performance in a dud movie. 
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The Burton movie was an artistic disaster, a debacle of unmitigated proportions that really damaged the brand name.
I don't know if the Apes brand was damaged by the 2001 picture. At that point it was something that had devolved into sci-fi chintz. The 2001 film all said and done grossed near $500 million worldwide theatrical and home video. The film's major problem is it's script and a third act that feels like it was cooked up as an emergency. Strangely enough, the third act of COWBOYS & ALIENS is almost identical, but no more successful!
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Posted: |
Aug 11, 2011 - 10:05 AM
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By: |
LeHah
(Member)
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The Burton movie was an artistic disaster, a debacle of unmitigated proportions that really damaged the brand name. I don't entirely blame it on Burton, though, he was just "doing it for the money." I blame the studio that had the project in development for nearly a decade and in the end, in the words of James Cameron, took the most egregious approach possible.
It just plain stinks. I don't like anything about it. It was a rushed production because there was a fear of a strike at the time, and everything shows that. Rick Baker did the best he could, but he wasn't happy with the script and Burton forced him to do the awful female chimp designs. The production design makes the entire movie look like bad Kabuki theatre, and Elfman's score is spread over it all like so much corn syrup.
Burton doesn't talk about the movie, and nearly everyone involved now acknowledges it was a misfire -- to say the least.
You've also managed to sum up every Burton movie following Ed Wood!
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Posted: |
Aug 11, 2011 - 10:56 AM
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By: |
Chris Avis
(Member)
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At that point it was something that had devolved into sci-fi chintz.
Which means nothing except that the public isn't very discriminating. Watching POTA 2001 the first time was THE worst moviegoing experience I've ever had. It was like torture, and made worse because I thought it would bomb at the boxoffice and go down as one of the worst disasters in Hollywood history. Go figure, Fox made a profit on it, though not as much as they hoped. As far as the POTA brand having become sci-fi chintz, well Fox ran it into the ground way back in 1973 with BATTLE FOR THE PLANET OF THE APES, then proceeded to bury it with the ill-conceived TV series.
What's a miracle is how highly regarded the original film remains, which is the best testament to that movie's true merits. Unfortunately, it's popularity has also been its curse.
Good grief, I'm *stunned* at the amount of rancor towards Burton's POTA. No one will mistake it for a classic, but I remember thoroughly enjoying it as a popcorn movie when it first came out. In my opinion, it's not even Burton's worst film - that honor goes to Alice in Wonderland. But to see comments like that above baffles me. I've seen dozens of movies in theater that were worse than Burton's POTA. It's leagues above much of the other dreck that we've gotten this summer: Pirates 4, Transformers 3, Cowboys and Aliens...
Great score by Elfman too.
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geez, i didn't mean to derail this thread to a discussion of the entire output of Tim Burton!
sorry, about that chief
bruce
ps ALICE was great (score included) ;CHARLIE was great
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the only two TB films besides PEE WEE I have not seen are SWEENEY & FISH which two people claim is his masterpiece!
some day.......
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Posted: |
Aug 12, 2011 - 6:10 AM
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By: |
Hurdy Gurdy
(Member)
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Mark Ford wrote - "Much of this score could have easily been written by any number of MV/RC alumnus asked to write in the same style. It's just too bad for some of us film music fans that some of our favorite composers with recognizable styles of their own have had to drop much of that and follow a common blue print which robs us of their uniqueness."
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This raises some interesting questions that I've been thinking about lately (perhaps for a separate thread).
If a composer starts streamlining his style, like Goldsmith did after TOTAL RECALL and Doyle has started to do recently, is it easy for them to go back to the older, more developed way?
On a comparable scale, if I find or develop a faster, easier way to do something at work, I'm unlikely to revert to the old way any time later. I'm not saying the work I do or have done is comparable to writing film music, but the thought process is likely to be similar.
To me, composers like Elfman and Williams have changed their styles over the years, it would seem, as a result of their evolving and developing styles, rather than writing less notes because it was pointless (Goldsmith) or tailoring it to sound like the 'in' sound (Doyle).
Will Doyle find it difficult to write in his old style on future projects?
The joy I had when I heard Williams' music at the end of The War Horse trailer evoke The River and Conrack was tremendous (although I'm not saying I only want my fave composers to always sound the same).
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Thought the film was quite good. was disappointed in Doyle's score though... nothing memorable about it.
Will give the soundtrack a miss and just enjoy his earlier scores like 'Much Ado','Little Princess' etc
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