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 Posted:   Aug 19, 2013 - 4:00 PM   
 By:   Alfachrger   (Member)

It's still not Basil. Despite the new technology and bigger orchestra, who knows if Basil would have liked the presentation. I love the rerecording because it does give us what Basil had down on paper in crystal clear sound, but it's missing something. All of that weird instrumentation and odd choir is Conan.

Judging by this (bad) recording, I think Basil would have found Raine's recording near what he wanted.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=57EPEfJ5fzw

 
 Posted:   Aug 20, 2013 - 1:01 AM   
 By:   Stephen Woolston   (Member)

It puzzles me how people have to be one-or-the-other. Why not both?

I have both the Intrada and the Tadlow/Prometheus and both get airplay. Why not?

The only redundant disc for me is the Varese one, but I can see why someone might like it for the program it had.

Normally, if I've loved an original and got every nuance of that etched on my brain, then that's the one I normally want because it's incredibly rare that a re-recording 30-years later has all the same nuances and 'voicings' I've already fallen in love with.

But this is one of those cases where Basil's unhappiness with the originals was well documented and I think the performance and interpretation by Nic Raine and the COPP is very powerful.

For me, it's not either-or, it's both-and.

 
 Posted:   Aug 20, 2013 - 1:31 AM   
 By:   OnlyGoodMusic   (Member)

It puzzles me how people have to be one-or-the-other. Why not both?

Exactly. The great thing about music is that it's subject to INTERPRETATION. Most film music fans seem to forget that e.g. the tempi in the "original" recordings are dictated by film editing demands rather than music logic. When Bennie Herrmann re-recorded his scores, he never even considered sticking to his film tempi. To say that the soundtrack tapes are the only acceptable option is ludicrous. We have no recording of a Beethoven symphony by the man himself, obviously. So shouldn't we be listening to any of the myriad of different, and often compellingly disparate, interpretations?

I own all the versions of CONAN available (going back to the original LP), and I like them all, each for different reasons. I enjoy the clarity of the new recording, and I enjoy the greater power of the original performance (warts and all).

 
 Posted:   Aug 20, 2013 - 6:47 AM   
 By:   TominAtl   (Member)

You know, all of the hoopla and back and forth and pontificating here has been more than just amusing to me, but educational. I have been wondering whether or not to get the re-recording or the Intrada. So, I decided to get both! Like the arguments mentioned earlier, there are more than 1 recordings of most classical pieces, many are great and have their own strengths and weaknesses.

If you can swing it, get em all. wink

 
 Posted:   Aug 20, 2013 - 7:35 AM   
 By:   YOR The Hunter From The Future   (Member)

Little gray cat is nice people!

 
 Posted:   Aug 20, 2013 - 8:42 AM   
 By:   johnmullin   (Member)

I think that it should be pretty clear to everyone here that the Tyler Bates recording is what Basil really intended.

 
 
 Posted:   Aug 20, 2013 - 9:02 AM   
 By:   The Beach Bum   (Member)

You also have of course the written score to follow as well to prove this point, don't you?


One doesn't need a score in front of them to judge a musical performance, just as one doesn't need to have read a script to judge an actor's performance.


So in other words, you can't answer my questions and you just pulling this out of your ass.


What kind of answer are you looking for? confused

 
 
 Posted:   Aug 20, 2013 - 9:05 AM   
 By:   Ford A. Thaxton   (Member)

You also have of course the written score to follow as well to prove this point, don't you?


One doesn't need a score in front of them to judge a musical performance, just as one doesn't need to have read a script to judge an actor's performance.


So in other words, you can't answer my questions and you just pulling this out of your ass.


What kind of answer are you looking for? confused


Something that he could point to that would support his claim.

But I didn't expect anything from him.


Ford A. Thaxton

 
 
 Posted:   Aug 20, 2013 - 9:09 AM   
 By:   The Beach Bum   (Member)

You also have of course the written score to follow as well to prove this point, don't you?


One doesn't need a score in front of them to judge a musical performance, just as one doesn't need to have read a script to judge an actor's performance.


So in other words, you can't answer my questions and you just pulling this out of your ass.


What kind of answer are you looking for? confused


Something that he could point to that would support his claim.


If you are referring to how I know there are far-fewer French horns on the Tadlow, it is because I can hear it. It's obvious.

 
 Posted:   Aug 20, 2013 - 9:49 AM   
 By:   Stephen Woolston   (Member)

Although I haven't seen a video of the recording of CONAN THE BARBRARIAN, I can confirm from the video of QUO VADIS that on that recording the COPP has the full normal complement of French horns — which is four.

And on the video of CONAN THE DESTROYER, it looks like there may be more than the full normal complement — six.



Go to the 1:48 point.

I don't see any reason to believe they'd have cut that down for the CONAN THE BARBARIAN recording.

How many French horns do you think CONAN THE BARBARIAN is supposed to have?

Cheers

 
 Posted:   Aug 20, 2013 - 10:22 AM   
 By:   General Kael   (Member)

Although I haven't seen a video of the recording of CONAN THE BARBRARIAN

Here you go!

 
 Posted:   Aug 20, 2013 - 10:27 AM   
 By:   Stephen Woolston   (Member)

Well in that recording it's clear there is at least the full normal complement of four, but because the camera closes in on three players (and you can see one mostly obscured player in the row behind), it's not clear there aren't more.

In the QUO VADIS video, I saw four players in one row. In DESTROYER, I think I saw six players in two rows of three (although it's possible they weren't all FRENCH horns, the video was a little low on detail). In BARBARIAN we definitely see three and one in a row behind, so maybe that row behind is another three like DESTROYER.

 
 Posted:   Aug 20, 2013 - 10:32 AM   
 By:   OnlyGoodMusic   (Member)

Although I haven't seen a video of the recording of CONAN THE BARBRARIAN, I can confirm from the video of QUO VADIS that on that recording the COPP has the full normal complement of French horns — which is four.

That's also the full normal complement of any standard-sized symphony orchestra.

 
 
 Posted:   Aug 20, 2013 - 12:39 PM   
 By:   Alfachrger   (Member)

Well in that recording it's clear there is at least the full normal complement of four, but because the camera closes in on three players (and you can see one mostly obscured player in the row behind), it's not clear there aren't more.

In the QUO VADIS video, I saw four players in one row. In DESTROYER, I think I saw six players in two rows of three (although it's possible they weren't all FRENCH horns, the video was a little low on detail). In BARBARIAN we definitely see three and one in a row behind, so maybe that row behind is another three like DESTROYER.


Looks like six horns in photo number 9 from this website.

http://www.ost.sk/reportaze/reportaz_conan_the_barbarian.php

 
 
 Posted:   Aug 20, 2013 - 2:33 PM   
 By:   The Beach Bum   (Member)

But what was unique about the original recording of "Anvil Of Crom" was that Poledouris used a much larger horn section for that cue -- over 20 strong. John Milius felt that the original orchestration lacked sufficient strength, and Poledouris's solution was to add a mamouth number of horns, giving the original a dynamic, primitive ferocity. This was not recreated for the City Of Prague version.

 
 Posted:   Aug 21, 2013 - 12:23 AM   
 By:   Loren   (Member)

So, what say you all?

There's no "vs.". I've got them all and I like them all since they're different.
And don't forget THE ADVENTURES OF CONAN, you have some in Raine's Destroyer, and both version really worth it.

 
 Posted:   Aug 21, 2013 - 12:52 AM   
 By:   Stephen Woolston   (Member)

But what was unique about the original recording of "Anvil Of Crom" was that Poledouris used a much larger horn section for that cue -- over 20 strong. John Milius felt that the original orchestration lacked sufficient strength, and Poledouris's solution was to add a mamouth number of horns, giving the original a dynamic, primitive ferocity. This was not recreated for the City Of Prague version.

Over twenty French horns? When the full orchestra complement is normally four? That seems phenomenal. Can you provide a citation?

 
 Posted:   Aug 21, 2013 - 3:53 AM   
 By:   pzfan   (Member)

But what was unique about the original recording of "Anvil Of Crom" was that Poledouris used a much larger horn section for that cue -- over 20 strong. John Milius felt that the original orchestration lacked sufficient strength, and Poledouris's solution was to add a mamouth number of horns, giving the original a dynamic, primitive ferocity. This was not recreated for the City Of Prague version.

Over twenty French horns? When the full orchestra complement is normally four? That seems phenomenal. Can you provide a citation?


It was mentioned in various reviews, like this one:
http://www.soundtrack.net/albums/database/?id=435
But maybe reviewer is pulling this out of his ass - as FAT would say.

 
 Posted:   Aug 21, 2013 - 4:00 AM   
 By:   OnlyGoodMusic   (Member)

Over 20 horns wouldn't make any sense. Anything above 8 produces no substantially different sound.

 
 
 Posted:   Aug 21, 2013 - 4:34 AM   
 By:   Bill Finn   (Member)

But what was unique about the original recording of "Anvil Of Crom" was that Poledouris used a much larger horn section for that cue -- over 20 strong. John Milius felt that the original orchestration lacked sufficient strength, and Poledouris's solution was to add a mamouth number of horns, giving the original a dynamic, primitive ferocity. This was not recreated for the City Of Prague version.

I'm curious because I have come across much the same story, except in the version I've seen, Poledouris takes out some trumpets from the brass section, leaving ONLY French Horns. Is there
some reference for all of this?

And I agree with the poster, 20 horns is not really going to sound much different than 8 horns.

Also, in answer to the orginal post, at this moment, I have the Varese and the Prometheus CDs on my shelf, and the DVDs as well.

 
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